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Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

 

Thank you, Rison-san.

Looks good to me, too.

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Youhan Kim <youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2026 1:51 PM
To: m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx; adachi tomoko(足立 朋子 □ＩＲＣ○ＷＳ開) <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Thanks, Mark.

Looks good to me.

 

Regards,

Youhan

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2026 11:40 AM
To: tomoko.adachi.b99@MAIL.TOSHIBA <tomoko.adachi.b99@MAIL.TOSHIBA>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Youhan Kim <youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.

OK, to try to make progress, I guess I can live with "20 MHz or wider"

for now at least.  I initially thought we then didn't need to say anything

about the width, but then I worried about all those 11a quarter-clocked

5 MHz BSSes, so I just left it as-is:

 

primary 20 MHz channel: In a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz, or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel that is used to transmit 20 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs). The primary 20 MHz channel is the primary channel.

 

primary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz, 160 MHz, or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 40 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

primary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), or an 80+80 MHz BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 80 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

(#11be)primary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 160 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

[Editor: move the following definition from 3.1 to 3.2, also]

primary channel: The common channel of operation for all stations (STAs) that are members of the basic service set (BSS). For example, iIn a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz the primary channel is athe primary 20 MHz channel.

 

secondary 20 MHz channel: In a 40 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that, together with the primary 20 MHz channel, forms the 40 MHz channel of the 40 MHz VHT BSS. In an 80 MHz or wider VHT BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that, together with the primary 20 MHz channel, forms the primary 40 MHz channel of the 80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the primary 40 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS. In a VHT BSS, tThe secondary 20 MHz channel is also the secondary channel.

 

secondary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that, together with the primary 40 MHz channel, forms the 80 MHz channel of the 80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 160 MHz or wider BSS, or an 80+80 MHz VHT BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that, together with the primary 40 MHz channel, forms the primary 80 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

secondary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel, that, together with the primary 80 MHz channel, forms the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 320 MHz BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 80 MHz channel that, together with the primary 80 MHz channel, forms the primary 160 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

(#11be)secondary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel not including adjacent to the primary 20160 MHz channel that, which together with the primary 160 MHz channel, forms the 320 MHz channel of the 320 MHz extremely high throughput (EHT) BSS.

 

secondary channel: A channel associated with a primary channel used to create a channel wider than the primary channel. In a 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the secondary channel is athe secondary 20 MHz channel. In an enhanced directional multi-gigabit (EDMG) BSS, aA 2.16 GHz channel associated with a primary channel used by enhanced directional multi-gigabit (EDMG) STAs for the purpose of creating a 4.32 GHz, 6.48 GHz, 8.64 GHz, 2.16+2.16 GHz, or 4.32+4.32 GHz channel.

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: 000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, 9 November 2026 11:17
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

 

Hi Youhan,

I see.

I’m fine to keep the primary channel and primary 20 MHz channel for a 20 MHz BSS.

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Youhan Kim <00002b3ff331b292-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2026 1:06 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Thanks, Mark, Tomo, Joe.

 

  • A 20 MHz BSS has a primary channel and a primary 20 MHz channel.

Hence, the "40 MHz or wider" in the definitions for the "primary 20 MHz channel" and the "primary channel" should be changed to "20 MHz or wider".

 

I didn't think a 20M BSS had an explicit primary 20M channel.  I

think back to 11ag -- these didn't have a primary 20M channel, they

just had a channel, no?  Is there any place in the spec that relies

on a 20M BSS having a primary channel or primary 20M channel?

 

Regarding primary channel and primary 20 MHz channel being present in a 20 MHz BSS, that has been the definition since the 11ac days at least.

So, if people want to remove primary channel and primary 20 MHz channel from 20 MHz BSS, then they should prove that nothing breaks in the standard by making such change at this point.

 

For example, 21.3.18.6.3 (CCA sensitivity for signals occupying the primary 20 MHz channel) is the place where the rule that if you detect a WLAN packet, then you need to set the CCA busy. If we now remove primary 20 MHz channel from a 20 MHz BSS, then are we saying that VHT, HE, EHT and UHR STAs are not required to set the CCA busy when they detect WLAN packet when operating in a 20 MHz BSS??

I am sure we can find many other cases where removing primary channel and primary 20 MHz channel from a 20 MHz BSS will break things in the standard.

 

Hence, I am against removing the primary channel and primary 20 MHz channel from a 20 MHz BSS.

 

Thanks,

Youhan

 

 

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2026 9:26 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

> We already have SST from 11ax.

 

OK, I am persuaded!

 

Proposed changes:

 

Change the definitions as follows:

 

primary 20 MHz channel: In a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz, or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel that is used to transmit 20 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs). The primary 20 MHz channel is the primary channel.

 

primary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz, 160 MHz, or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 40 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

primary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), or an 80+80 MHz BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 80 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

(#11be)primary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 160 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

[Editor: move the following definition from 3.1 to 3.2, also]

primary channel: The common channel of operation for all stations (STAs) that are members of the basic service set (BSS). For example, iIn a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz the primary channel is athe primary 20 MHz channel.

 

secondary 20 MHz channel: In a 40 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that, together with the primary 20 MHz channel, forms the 40 MHz channel of the 40 MHz VHT BSS. In an 80 MHz or wider VHT BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that, together with the primary 20 MHz channel, forms the primary 40 MHz channel of the 80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the primary 40 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS. In a VHT BSS, tThe secondary 20 MHz channel is also the secondary channel.

 

secondary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that, together with the primary 40 MHz channel, forms the 80 MHz channel of the 80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 160 MHz or wider BSS, or an 80+80 MHz VHT BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that, together with the primary 40 MHz channel, forms the primary 80 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

secondary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel, that, together with the primary 80 MHz channel, forms the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 320 MHz BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 80 MHz channel that, together with the primary 80 MHz channel, forms the primary 160 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

(#11be)secondary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel not including adjacent to the primary 20160 MHz channel that, which together with the primary 160 MHz channel, forms the 320 MHz channel of the 320 MHz extremely high throughput (EHT) BSS.

 

secondary channel: A channel associated with a primary channel used to create a channel wider than the primary channel. In a 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the secondary channel is athe secondary 20 MHz channel. In an enhanced directional multi-gigabit (EDMG) BSS, aA 2.16 GHz channel associated with a primary channel used by enhanced directional multi-gigabit (EDMG) STAs for the purpose of creating a 4.32 GHz, 6.48 GHz, 8.64 GHz, 2.16+2.16 GHz, or 4.32+4.32 GHz channel.

 

Yoroshiku onegaishimasu,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: 000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, 9 November 2026 08:53
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

 

From what Youhan attached, I see there is

primary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 160 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

while for others they appear as follows:

primary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 40 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

primary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), or an 80+80 MHz BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel and is used to transmit 80 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

Note that when copied and pasted, the edit history disappeared…

 

We already have SST from 11ax.

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2026 10:39 AM
To: adachi tomoko(足立 朋子 □ＩＲＣ○ＷＳ開) <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>; youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

> For the primary 40/80/160 MHz,  I think we need the part “contains the primary 20 MHz channel and”. (Youhan added that part for the primary 40/80 MHz channels, but forgot to add it for the primary 160 MHz, I assume.)

 

Youhan didn't forget to add it; it's currently there in mf/D3.0.

 

My question is why this is necessary.  Doesn't "the <n> MHz channel that is used to transmit <n> MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs)" already mean it contains the P20 (at least until we have DSO/NPCA)?

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>
Sent: Monday, 9 November 2026 08:31
To: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>; youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

 

Hi Mark, Youhan, and Joe,

 

For just a 20 MHz BSS, I don’t think we need to explicitly say that it uses the primary 20 MHz channel. These primary and secondary channels are introduced from 11n for 40 MHz BSS.

 

For the primary 40/80/160 MHz,  I think we need the part “contains the primary 20 MHz channel and”. (Youhan added that part for the primary 40/80 MHz channels, but forgot to add it for the primary 160 MHz, I assume.)

 

And at this stage, I don’t think we need to add “or wider” for the primary 160 MHz channel. We can add it in the future when such condition is required.

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2026 9:13 AM
To: Youhan Kim <youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; adachi tomoko(足立 朋子 □ＩＲＣ○ＷＳ開) <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Thanks Youhan and Joe for the feedback.

 

  • A 20 MHz BSS has a primary channel and a primary 20 MHz channel.

Hence, the "40 MHz or wider" in the definitions for the "primary 20 MHz channel" and the "primary channel" should be changed to "20 MHz or wider".

 

I didn't think a 20M BSS had an explicit primary 20M channel.  I

think back to 11ag -- these didn't have a primary 20M channel, they

just had a channel, no?  Is there any place in the spec that relies

on a 20M BSS having a primary channel or primary 20M channel?

 

  • What was to reason for deleting "containing the primary 20 MHz channel" from primary 160 MHz channel?

 

To align it with all the other "primary n MHz channel" definitions.

I don't think primary 160M is special, is it?  All the primary ns

contain the primary 20.

 

Suggest that for the primary 180 MHz channel definitions the "or wider" text be added for consistency and to future-proof the definition.

 

(You mean 160 MHz, of course.)  I considered this, but I was worried

there would be an objection because there are in mf/D3.0 no >320M channels

in the 1-7G band.  The definition for S80 will similarly need extension

if we end up having >320M channels, since it doesn't have "or wider"

either.

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: Youhan Kim <youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, 8 November 2026 13:47
To: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba
Subject: Re: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

Hi, Mark.

 

  • A 20 MHz BSS has a primary channel and a primary 20 MHz channel.

Hence, the "40 MHz or wider" in the definitions for the "primary 20 MHz channel" and the "primary channel" should be changed to "20 MHz or wider".

  • What was to reason for deleting "containing the primary 20 MHz channel" from primary 160 MHz channel?

 

Thanks,

Youhan

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, November 6, 2026 2:58 PM
To: Youhan Kim <youhank@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.

Thanks a lot for all you hard work on this, Youhan.

 

I have attempted to fold this into my comment-resolution submission,

but I found some additional changes.  Please review the following to

make sure it's OK with you!

 

Change the definitions as follows:

 

primary 20 MHz channel: In a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz, or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel that is used to transmit 20 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs). The primary 20 MHz channel is the primary channel.

 

primary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz, 160 MHz, or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel that is used to transmit 40 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

primary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), or an 80+80 MHz BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel that is used to transmit 80 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

(#11be)primary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel that contains the primary 20 MHz channel is used to transmit 160 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

[Editor: move the following definition from 3.1 to 3.2, also]

primary channel: The common channel of operation for all stations (STAs) that are members of the basic service set (BSS). For example, iIn a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz the primary channel is athe primary 20 MHz channel.

 

secondary 20 MHz channel: In a 40 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that, together with the primary 20 MHz channel, forms the 40 MHz channel of the 40 MHz VHT BSS. In an 80 MHz or wider VHT BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that, together with the primary 20 MHz channel, forms the primary 40 MHz channel of the 80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the primary 40 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS. In a VHT BSS, tThe secondary 20 MHz channel is also the secondary channel.

 

secondary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that, together with the primary 40 MHz channel, forms the 80 MHz channel of the 80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 160 MHz or wider BSS, or an 80+80 MHz VHT BSS, operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that, together with the primary 40 MHz channel, forms the primary 80 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

secondary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz very high throughput (VHT) basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel, that, together with the primary 80 MHz channel, forms the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz VHT BSS. In a 320 MHz BSS operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 80 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 80 MHz channel that, together with the primary 80 MHz channel, forms the primary 160 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

(#11be)secondary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the 160 MHz channel not including adjacent to the primary 20160 MHz channel that, which together with the primary 160 MHz channel, forms the 320 MHz channel of the 320 MHz extremely high throughput (EHT) BSS.

 

secondary channel: A channel associated with a primary channel used to create a channel wider than the primary channel. In a 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS) operating between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz, the secondary channel is athe secondary 20 MHz channel. In an enhanced directional multi-gigabit (EDMG) BSS, aA 2.16 GHz channel associated with a primary channel used by enhanced directional multi-gigabit (EDMG) STAs for the purpose of creating a 4.32 GHz, 6.48 GHz, 8.64 GHz, 2.16+2.16 GHz, or 4.32+4.32 GHz channel.

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: Youhan Kim <00002b3ff331b292-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, 5 November 2026 20:42
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Thanks, Mark and Tomo.

 

Updated to incorporate latest feedback.

As for the 3G6 and 4G9 band, I switched the language to BSS operating "between 1 GHz and 7.250 GHz" (a phrase that is copied from 802.11be-2024).

 

Mark,

I believe you will incorporate this into one of your documents.

Please feel free to make further editorial changes if needed.

 

Regards,

Youhan

From: 000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2026 11:36 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

 

Hi Rison-san,

Channels in 4.9 GHz should be categorized as channels in the 5 GHz band by, say, 19.3.15.3, where the channel starting frequency given by dot11ChannelStartingFactor × 500 kHz and dot11ChannelStartingFactor = 8000, shouldn’t they?

tomo

 

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2026 4:26 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Thanks for the further update, Youhan.  My comments on this latest version:

 

- What about the boutique bands/subbands, such as the 3G6 band and

the 4G9 band?  From a quick skim it looks to me as if the 4G9 band

can have 40M channels.  Do we wave our hands around and say it's

covered by "5G band"?  For the 3G6 band is "primary" never used?

 

- I think something is needed to direct the Editor to move the "primary

channel" definition from 3.1 to 3.2

 

- "the 160 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 160 MHz channel that together with the primary 160 MHz channel, forms the 320 MHz channel of the 320 MHz BSS"

needs a comma before the "together".  But then the other definitions

should align with this "the X channel that, together with the Y channel,

forms the Z channel" structure

 

- All the "of the xxx MHz BSS"es should be just "of the BSS" since

the earlier part of the sentence already identifies the BSS width (4x)

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: Youhan Kim <00002b3ff331b292-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, 5 November 2026 01:00
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

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--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Thanks, Mark and Tomo.

Please find an updated version attached.

I haven't really thought about what needs to be done in 11bn.  🙂

 

Regards,

Youhan

 

 

From: 000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2026 3:55 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

 

Hello Youhan and Mark,

Sorry for sending my response a lap behind.

I am fine with Youhan’s text if Mark’s suggestions are applied. My original suggestion was to add the frequency range, wasn’t it? 😉

According to whether the text is NPCA-safe or not, when those channels are in use containing the primary 20 MHz channel that is distinguished from the NPCA primary channel, those are “primary”, from my understanding.

Do we need to define the channels in combination with the NPCA primary channel in TGbn?

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2026 6:24 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Thanks, Youhan.  Not a bad direction.  I attach some comments.

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: Youhan Kim <00002b3ff331b292-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, 4 November 2026 20:27
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

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--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Resending w/ the correct attachment.

 

Thanks,

Youhan

 

 

From: Youhan Kim <00002b3ff331b292-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2026 12:22 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Hi,

Thanks Mark, Tomo and Chaoming for the discussion.

 

11bq also has 320 MHz BSS, so the new language is knowingly creating more work for 11bq.

E.g., the existing secondary 160 MHz channel definition was restricted to EHT BSS and hence did not create issues for 11bq, while the new language proposed by Mark now applies to 11bq even though I do not think 11bq would have a secondary 160 MHz channel.

While I understand that 11mf comes before 11bq, I don't think we should knowingly create more work for 11bq (or other TGs).

 

Also, there were quite a bit of thoughts that have gone into the existing text over multiple iterations, and some of the proposed changes seem to simply delete them. If it is absolutely necessary, sure - but I do not think this is one of those situations.

 

Hence, I would instead propose the attached document as the text changes to resolve CID 2630.

 

Thanks,

Youhan

 

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2026 2:56 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

I think I don't have any objections to modifying the wordings like this:

 

primary 20 MHz channel: The 20 MHz channel that is used to transmit 20 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs). The primary 20 MHz channel is also called “the primary channel”.

 

[Editor: move the following definition from 3.1 to 3.2, also]

primary channel: The common channel of operation for all stations (STAs) that are members of the basic service set (BSS). For example, in a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz BSS the primary channel is a primary 20 MHz channel. In a BSS that is at least 20 MHz wide but less than 2.16 GHz wide, “the primary channel” is the primary 20 MHz channel.

 

Yoroshiku onegaishimasu,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: 000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <000052fb853e1ea5-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, 4 November 2026 09:22
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

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--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

 

Rison-san,

 

Sorry, I somehow missed the definition of the primary channel…

Still want to ask for adding the following at the end of the primary 20 MHz channel definition.

The primary 20 MHz channel is also called “the primary channel”.

 

Chaoming,

I would say that’s a work for TGbn. :0

If something like, interpret the bandwidth for DBE as a BSS bandwidth when DBE is applied, will it work?

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: 罗朝明(Chaoming Luo) <000015d97e832564-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2026 5:35 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

Hi Mark,

 

A clarification question about the text like “80 MHz basic service set (BSS)”:

11bn has defined DBE mode. If an AP’s operating bw is 80 MHz, and it enables DBE mode with 160 MHz DBE bw, should the corresponding BSS be a 80 MHz BSS or a 160 MHz BSS?

 

BR,

Chaoming

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: 2026年11月4日 16:22
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

We already have a definition of primary channel:

 

primary channel: The common channel of operation for all stations (STAs) that are members of the basic service set (BSS). For example, in a 20 MHz, 40 MHz, 80 MHz, 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz BSS the primary channel is a primary 20 MHz channel.

 

Is this not adequate?  (Don't think too hard about NPCA…)

 

Couple of small editorials:

 

secondary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that together form the (primary, for an 80+80 MHz or 160 MHz or wider BSS) 80 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

secondary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS), the 160 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel that together with the primary 160 MHz channel form the 320 MHz channel of the 320 MHz BSS.

 

Yoroshiku onegaishimasu,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>
Sent: Wednesday, 4 November 2026 07:56
To: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

 

Thank you.

 

How about the primary channel? Why don’t you add the following at the end of the primary 20 MHz channel definition?

The primary 20 MHz channel is also called “the primary channel”.

And I forgot why we didn’t add “primary channel” when adding “secondary channel”… Why not?

I see the logic through your proposal that the “secondary 20 MHz channel” only applies for non *MG BSSes, while the “secondary channel” can be also applied to *MG BSSes.

The same interpretation should apply to the “primary 20 MHz channel” and the “primary channel”.

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2026 4:28 PM
To: adachi tomoko(足立 朋子 □ＩＲＣ○ＷＳ開) <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

I've been working on this a bit more, and I've come up with the following:

 

secondary 20 MHz channel: In a 40 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the (primary, for an 80 MHz or wider BSS) 40 MHz channel of the BSS. The secondary 20 MHz channel is also called “the secondary channel”.

 

secondary 40 MHz channel: In an 80 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), the 40 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 40 MHz channel that together form the (primary, for a 160 MHz or wider BSS) 80 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

secondary 80 MHz channel: In a 160 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), the 80 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel that together with the primary 80 MHz channel form the (primary, for a 320 MHz or wider BSS) 160 MHz channel of the BSS.  In an 80+80 MHz BSS, the 80 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel that together with the primary 80 MHz channel form the 80+80 MHz channel of the BSS.

 

secondary 160 MHz channel: In a 320 MHz basic service set (BSS), the 160 MHz channel not including the primary 20 MHz channel that together with the primary 160 MHz channel form the 320 MHz channel of the 320 MHz BSS.

 

secondary channel: A channel associated with a primary channel that is used to create a channel wider than the primary channel. In a basic service set (BSS) that is wider than 20 MHz but narrower than 2.16 GHz, “the secondary channel” is the secondary 20 MHz channel.

 

primary 20 MHz channel: The 20 MHz channel that is used to transmit 20 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

primary 40 MHz channel: The 40 MHz channel that is used to transmit 40 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

primary 80 MHz channel: The 80 MHz channel that is used to transmit 80 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

primary 160 MHz channel: The 160 MHz channel that is used to transmit 160 MHz physical layer (PHY) protocol data units (PPDUs).

 

I think "adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel" means the definitions don't

apply to *MG since these don't have primary 20 MHz channels.

 

The "secondary 160 MHz channel" definition will still have to be

modified if WIN introduces >320M channels, but at least the scope

for spec rot has been significantly reduced!

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>
Sent: Wednesday, 4 November 2026 01:52
To: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

 

Konnichiha Rison-san,

 

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

I prefer your last proposal. How about adding the frequency range to exclude the *MG BSSes?

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, October 30, 2026 7:45 PM
To: adachi tomoko(足立 朋子 □ＩＲＣ○ＷＳ開) <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Konbanha Adachi-san,

 

It would look like this:

 

secondary 20 MHz channel: In a 40 MHz basic service set (BSS), the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the 40 MHz channel of the 40 MHz BSS. In an 80 MHz BSS, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the primary 40 MHz channel of the 80 MHz BSS. In a 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz BSS, the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the primary 40 MHz channel of the 160 MHz or 80+80 MHz BSS. In a BSS, the secondary 20 MHz channel is also the secondary channel.

 

Some other notes:

 

- The definition probably also needs to be extended to support 320 MHz BSSes.

- The "In a BSS," at the end is a bit weird now, and should probably be deleted.

- I guess the "secondary {40, 80, 160} MHz channel" definitions should be similarly changed.

 

Or we could make ourselves less vulnerable to spec rot (e.g. >320M BSSes in WIN) by just saying:

 

secondary 20 MHz channel: In a 40 MHz or wider basic service set (BSS), the 20 MHz channel adjacent to the primary 20 MHz channel that together form the (primary, for an 80 MHz or wider BSS) 40 MHz channel of the BSS. The secondary 20 MHz channel is also called the secondary channel.

 

… but maybe then we need to exclude *MG BSSes!

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

From: tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba <tomoko.adachi.b99@mail.toshiba>
Sent: Friday, 30 October 2026 10:31
To: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

Caution: External Emails May Contain Spoofed Addresses, Malicious Links, or Attachments – Verify Before Engaging.

 

Hi Mark,

 

I’m not really sure how the definition will look like when the proposed change is accepted, but it seems OK.

 

The secondary 20 MHz channel should apply also when used in 2G4 for 40 MHz and in 6G for 40/80/160/320 MHz.

 

I’ll be at Bangkok.

 

Best regards,

tomo

 

From: Mark RISON <m.rison@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, October 30, 2026 6:56 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [STDS-802-11-TGM] 11mf/D3.0 CID 2630 (definition of "secondary 20 MHz channel")

 

--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Task Group M Technical Reflector ---

I was asked to post to the reflector regarding CID 2630:

 

Comment:

"secondary 20 MHz channel" definition only seems to apply to a VHT BSS and hence does not apply to an HT or HE or EHT BSS in the 2G4 or 6G band [Subclause 3.2 at 281.56]

Proposed Change:

Delete "VHT" and "very high throughput (VHT)" throughout the definition

Proposed Resolution:

ACCEPTED [Motion CID 2630]

 

If you have any comments, this will come back up at the November F2F,

or you could reply here.

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

 

--

Mark RISON, Standards Architect, WLAN   English/Esperanto/Français

Samsung Cambridge Solution Centre       Tel: +44 1223  434600

1 Cambridge Square, Cambridge CB4 0AE   Fax: +44 1223  434601

ROYAUME UNI                             WWW: http://www.samsung.com/uk

 

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