From pneves@AV.IT.PT Fri Apr 23 10:40:29 2004 Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:32:46 -0600 From: Pedro Neves To: l.napoli@ieee.org Subject: Re: [STDS-802-16] Broadcast Dear Mr. Raja, I perfectly understood the problem concerning the broadcast connection, and I agree with you. However, regarding the multicast data connection, I have not understood yet if there is defined a special CID for multicast data and another special CID for multicast polling? If a CID for multicast data is defined, then the broadcast would be a special case from this one. Resuming, is there a multicast data connection (CID) defined in the standard? Best Regards, Pedro Neves -------------------------------------------------------------------- Pedro Miguel Naia Neves Instituto Telecomunica^Í^Ûes - http://www.av.it.pt Aveiro - Portugal Phone: +351 234 377 900 Mobile: +351 96 618 75 82 Homepage: http://daidalos.av.it.pt/~pneves MSN contact: etneves@hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________________ From: owner-stds-802-16@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG [mailto:owner-stds-802-16@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG] On Behalf Of Raja Banerjea Sent: quarta-feira, 21 de Abril de 2004 16:52 To: STDS-802-16@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [STDS-802-16] [STDS-802-16] +AFs-STDS-802-16+AF0- Broadcast Vladimir, The problem with using broadcast CID (0xFFFF) to transmit broadcast data is more on the receiving MAC CPS. The data received on the broadcast CID (0xFFFF) could now be data or management. The CPS has to try to identify the packet as a management packet based on the MAC Management Type. If the type is invalid then it could be data packet and should be passed to the CS. Further if the data packet wrongly included the first byte equal to the MAC Management Type, a broadcast data packet would be understood by the receiving MAC CPS as a MAC management message. This is not a good solution. I therefore feel broadcast CID should only be used to broadcast MAC Management messages. As Radu and Eyal suggested broadcast of data packets is a special case of multicast data connection (not to be confused with multicast polling) where all the SS are part of the multicast group. Regards, -Raja -----Original Message----- From: Vladimir Yanover [mailto:vladimir.yanover@ALVARION.COM] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 4:09 AM To: STDS-802-16@listserv.ieee.org Subject: Re: [STDS-802-16] +AFs-STDS-802-16+AF0- Broadcast Eyal, Seems that the standard does not preclude from sending data over broadcast connection. Another question is whether we may establish a service flow associated with broadcast connection. I think, we cannot, then there is no way for data entering CS SAP to be routed to broadcast connection. By the way, multicast connections are not related to multicast [polling] groups. Vladimir -----Original Message----- From: Eyal Verbin [mailto:everbin@AIRSPAN.COM] Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 1:39 PM To: STDS-802-16@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: [STDS-802-16] Broadcast Section 6.1 of the standard states that " In addition to individually addressed messages, messages may also be sent on multicast connections (control messages and video distribution are examples of multicast applications) as well as broadcast to all stations." Correct me if I'm wrong, but broadcast transmission is limited to MAC management messages (MAPs, DCD,...) and can't be used to transfer data. Therefore, the only way to broadcast data is to form a multicast group containing all SS's Eyal -----Original Message----- From: owner-stds-802-16@listserv.ieee.org [mailto:owner-stds-802-16@listserv.ieee.org]On Behalf Of Don Leimer Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 8:26 PM To: STDS-802-16@listserv.ieee.org Subject: Re: [STDS-802-16] Clarification regarding SS power level control Only one more comment. The final 4dB of error will also be reduced by subsequent BS commands, and relative error diminishes to +/- 0.5dB for the final error (relative to the BS's capability to measure power) -----Original Message----- From: Raja Banerjea [mailto:RBanerjea@PROXIM.COM] Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 9:14 AM To: STDS-802-16@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [STDS-802-16] Clarification regarding SS power level control The power control method is a closed loop method where the Base station asks for further power control corrections if required. If the base station requests the subscriber station in the RNG-RESP to increase the power level by 30dB the SS should increase it by 30dB with a relative accuracy of 4dB. If the Base station is going to increase the power of the SS in 5 steps and the BS requests the SS to increase the power by 8dB the SS will increase it by 8dB with a relative accuracy of 4dB. In the subsequent RNG-RESP message the BS instead of requesting a power increase of 8dB will request for 8dB+(relative accuracy). Therefore after each increase requested from the BS the relative accuracy should be 4dB. This assumes that the BS can make an accurate measurement of the SS's power increase. Any comments ? Regards, -Raja -----Original Message----- From: Crozier, Eugene [mailto:Eugene_Crozier@SRTELECOM.COM] Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 6:26 AM To: STDS-802-16@listserv.ieee.org Subject: Re: [STDS-802-16] Clarification regarding SS power level control My understanding of this is that the step size should be greater than 1 dB but less than 8 dB (I'd assumed for the relative accuracy that the 50% of the step size can be no more than 4 dB), but the number of steps is based on the step size and the relative accuracy to achieve the minimum control range, so for 1 dB steps, the number of steps can be between 60 and 20 (30/0.5 and 30/1.5) for a 30 dB range, and for 8 dB step size the number of steps between 8 and 3 for the 30 dB range. Regards Eugene Crozier -----Original Message----- From: Eyal Verbin [mailto:everbin@AIRSPAN.COM] Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 8:22 AM To: STDS-802-16@listserv.ieee.org Subject: [STDS-802-16] Clarification regarding SS power level control Power level control for the OFDM PHY is defined in section 8.3.9.1: " For an SS not supporting subchannelization, the transmitter shall support a monotonic power level control of 30 dB minimum. For an SS supporting subchannelization, the transmitter shall support a monotonic power level control of 50 dB minimum. The minimum step size shall be no more than 1 dB. The relative accuracy of the power control mechanism is +/-50% of the step size in dB, but no more than 4 dB. As an example, for a step size of 5 dB the relative accuracy is 2.5 dB. For a BS, the transmitter shall support a monotonic power level control of 10 dB minimum."&+nbsp; Looking at the SS (subchannelization) for example, it is possible to go from Min power to Max power either in 5 steps of 8 dB or in a single step of 50dB. In the first option the accumulated offset can reach 5*4dB (20dB) wheras in the second option the tolerance is limited to 4dB. Does anyone have a more clear interpretation of this text? Eyal Verbin This mail passed through mail.alvarion.com ******************************************************************************** **** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses. ******************************************************************************** **** This mail was sent via mail.alvarion.com ******************************************************************************** **** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses. ******************************************************************************** **** This mail was sent via mail.alvarion.com ******************************************************************************** **** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & computer viruses. ******************************************************************************** ****