Adrian,
I think you misunderstood. No one was suggesting moving the closing EC earlier.
I think Bob was saying that an opening EC on Sunday night would be as bad for productive EC meetings as having the closing plenary on Thursday night due to
potential short tempers lack of quality deliberation due to tiredness.
I was agreeing that a late night opening EC isn’t a good idea and that I was thinking Sunday afternoon not night.
Pat
From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** [mailto:STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org]
On Behalf Of Stephens, Adrian P
Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2014 10:54 PM
To: STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [802SEC] Maximizing Tutorial time on Monday and Tuesday during Plenary Sessions
Regarding the closing EC, 802.11 does not have the luxury of
pushing this any earlier. As it is, any materials contingent on
the WG closing plenary have to be prepared in a 1-2 hour time
gap.
If the Friday EC were to move to Thursday night, then we would
lose most of Thursday (2 hours CAC, 4 hours closing plenary) from
TG activities.
<irony>
In that case, I’d advocate the opening EC be on Saturday, with WG meetings on Sunday.
</irony>
Best Regards,
Adrian P STEPHENS
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I remember. Geoff and Tony too.
I wasn’t suggesting 8 PM to Midnight on Sunday for the EC meeting – the suggest is Sunday afternoon.
The closing EC meeting goes better with most of us having a chance to catch up and prepare for it on Friday morning. That as well as moving it away from late hours on Thursday
has improved the quality of our process as well as our tempers. That’s a secondary reason to not move the more WG closing plenaries to Friday morning though the travel issue for the rest of our membership is the primary reason.
Pat
Pat, even though I agree with you, I'll simply ask:
Do enough of the current EC members remember how it was doing Thursday evening closing EC meetings?
Please also remember how travel fatigue makes participants perform during Sunday evening rules meetings as you consider rescheduling EC meetings.
Travel for a meeting starting on Monday often requires leaving on Sunday and sometimes on Saturday. I think that many would prefer to have one weekend impacted even if the
impact eats deeper into the weekend rather than having two weekends impacted. Therefore, it is better to move to start earlier having some meetings on Sunday rather than pushing Working Groups to meet on Friday morning.
Pat
From: ***** IEEE 802 Executive Committee List ***** [mailto:STDS-802-SEC@ieee.org]
On Behalf Of Jon Rosdahl
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 8:42 PM
To: STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [802SEC] Maximizing Tutorial time on Monday and Tuesday during Plenary Sessions
I appreciate your input and candor.
After 8 hours of no response except a request that some may want to respond directly to me, I did not see that my offering to receive input as bad. Their input would be presented by me later next week or during the EC meeting.
What if we asked the WG to not close their work until Friday?
Would it make sense to have a 2 week meeting?
I agree that there are lots of alternatives.
Some like scrambled eggs while others like sunny side up or Benedict.
It is the alternatives that we will discuss, and then decide to follow a plan until we deem it needing to change.
And one of the alternatives is no change at all...
Cheers,
Jon
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Rosdahl Senior Standards Architect
hm:801-756-1496 CSR Technologies Inc.
cell:801-376-6435 10871 North 5750 West
office: 801-492-4023 Highland, UT 84003
A Job is only necessary to eat!
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On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 9:29 PM, <John_DAmbrosia@dell.com> wrote:
Jon,
I disagree – this is not fine and not in line with the action item.
Personally – plenary weeks are very limited opportunities to get together with colleagues for general
consensus building. But these weeks are so filled that we need to help our members find additional time.
Personally, I would throw out that the EC should consider meeting on Sunday in order to give a full
day to the members on Monday. Things are that bad in terms of opportunities for us all to meet.
I think asking presenters to characterize their meetings is reasonable. They can describe it as
something that is general or technology specific. For example, as chair of 400G group, my tutorial would be very specific to wireline technologies. I really doubt the 802.11 crowd would care about the technical details of a tutorial. They might care about
the application uses. But as the tutorial creator – I would have a feeling for this.
If a meeting were not deemed generic, Paul could decree that the meeting time is available for use.
My $0.02 as someone having to deal with this issue.
J
From:
owner-stds-802-sec@ieee.org [mailto:owner-stds-802-sec@ieee.org]
On Behalf Of Jon Rosdahl
Sent: Friday, October 24, 2014 11:15 PM
To: STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [802SEC] Maximizing Tutorial time on Monday and Tuesday during Plenary Sessions
It has been pointed out to me that there may be some that would like to respond directly to me rather than to the open group.
That is fine.
Please send feedback/comments to
jrosdahl@ieee.org
Always happy to help,
Regards,
Jon
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Rosdahl Senior Standards Architect
hm:801-756-1496 CSR Technologies Inc.
cell:801-376-6435 10871 North 5750 West
office: 801-492-4023 Highland, UT 84003
A Job is only necessary to eat!
A Family is necessary to be happy!!
On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 1:21 PM, Jon Rosdahl <jrosdahl@ieee.org> wrote:
I have an action item to start the discussion on the reflector for how can we maximize the time we have allocated for Tutorials.
Sometimes we have tutorials that some believe are not for the whole of 802.
Sometimes we have tutorials that everyone believes that they are for the whole of 802.
Sometimes we have tutorials that some believe are for only one WG.
This has caused a bit of angst. Historically, we have had rules that said that during the Plenaries no WG meetings were to be held on Monday or Tuesday to allow for the Tutorials to
be held.
Then we has a period where WGs could hold meeting regardless of the Tutorial schedule.
Currently we have said that WGs should not hold meetings on Monday evenings, to clear the schedule for Tutorials, and that on Tuesday evenings if we have overflow Tutorials they can be
held in parallel with WG meetings.
We all recognize that our time is short and very full.
Some WG utilize more time from Monday to Friday than others.
Each WG utilizes the amount of time to match what they believe their Members want.
How to squeeze more time has lead to this discussion on when a WG could try to gain more time?
Comments and suggestions?
I will look for your input and try to summarize both sides for discussion in San Antonio.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Rosdahl Senior Standards Architect
hm:801-756-1496 CSR Technologies Inc.
cell:801-376-6435 10871 North 5750 West
office: 801-492-4023 Highland, UT 84003
A Job is only necessary to eat!
A Family is necessary to be happy!!
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