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Re: [STDS-802-11-TGAK] 802.11ak - Encryption of EPD formated frames



Hi Philippe,

On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 8:20 AM, Philippe Klein <philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Hi Adrian,
> I first agree with you that the key management the issue rather then
> encryption in secured networks but I am not following you on the 2 separate
> networks independently managed in the case of wired/wireless GLK bridged
> networks. It is quite critical that such network is part of the dame
> infrastructure and must be key manageable from the same management protocol
> but I do not see what prevent to use 802.1X for both wired and wireless
> links.

802.11i claims to use 802.1X and, in any case, both 802.11i and 802.1X
use EAP (Extensible Authentication Protocol). (Possibly 802.11w does
also but I'm not sure.) So, while I haven't done a detailed study, I
don't see why they couldn't both use the same EAP method for key
agreement including, possibly, the same certificates.

> My initial mail was more focused on the encryption format to **eventually**
> allow an encrypted EDP frames to be able to be transparently bridged by the
> bridges connected by a GLK link...

I find your use of "transparently bridged" a bit odd. Either we are
talking about link security, in which case the formats, etc., don't
leak off the local link, or we are talking about some sort of
end-to-end or edge-to-edge security, in which case whatever format is
being used is transparently tunneled through...

Thanks,
Donald
=============================
 Donald E. Eastlake 3rd   +1-508-333-2270 (cell)
 155 Beaver Street, Milford, MA 01757 USA
 d3e3e3@xxxxxxxxx

> Sincerely /Ph
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 23, 2015, at 2:33, "Stephens, Adrian P" <Adrian.P.Stephens@xxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
> Hello Philippe,
>
>
>
> I personally don’t think encryption is the central issue.   The big deal, to
> me, is key management,  which is often the weakness
>
> in any system of security.   Trying to merge 802.11 credential management
> (which focusses on ease of use,
>
> user interface & presentation,  automatic provisioning of credentials from
> operators) with the wired
>
> infrastructure credential management seems to me like something too hard to
> consider.
>
>
>
> In my mind we have distinct types of network,  managed by distinct operators
> with very different infrastructure.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
>
>
> Adrian P STEPHENS
>
>
>
> Tel: +44 (1793) 404825 (office)
> Tel: +1 (971) 330 6025 (mobile) ç please note new number
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------
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>
>
> From: Philippe Klein [mailto:philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: 22 January 2015 21:05
> To: STDS-802-11-TGAK@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGAK] 802.11ak - Encryption of EPD formated frames
>
>
>
> Hi Dan,
>
> I understand it is the case today but as EPD mode is  a totally “new” format
> for 802.11 should we try to unified as much as possible with the Ethernet
> format including encrypted frame format ? This was the initial sense of my
> question …
>
>
>
> /Ph
>
>
>
> From: Dan Harkins [mailto:dharkins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2015 10:59 PM
> To: Philippe Klein; STDS-802-11-TGAK@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGAK] 802.11ak - Encryption of EPD formated frames
>
>
>
>
>
>   Hi Philippe,
>
>
>
> On 1/21/15 9:28 PM, "Philippe Klein" <philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
> The current P802.11ak_D0.06 draft version does not mention any requirement
> in regard to the encryption of EPD formatted frames.
>
>
>
> I suggest we add a requirement that EPD formatted frames must be encrypted
> in a way compatible with IEEE 802.1AE (MACsec) as the 802.3/Ethernet frames
> are (notice that 802.11ad crypto mode is AES-GCM, the same crypto mode that
> the default Cypher Suite of 802.1AE).
>
>
>
>   While the cipher mode is the same the format of the frames and the
> location of the AAD passed to
>
> AES-GCM is different. I think if it's an 802.11 frame it should be protected
> the way the 802.11 standard
>
> specifies.
>
>
>
>   regards,
>
>
>
>   Dan.
>
>
>
> If you agree I will post a contribution that could be discuss next Monday
> during the conf call.
>
> Thank you
>
>
>
> /Philippe
>
>
>
> Philippe Klein, PhD |Technical Director, Broadband Technology Group
>
> Broadcom Corporation | Golan House, P.O.Box 273, Airport City, 70100 Israel
>
> (M) +972 54 313 4500 | philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>
>
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