Thread Links Date Links
Thread Prev Thread Next Thread Index Date Prev Date Next Date Index

Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

Hi All,
Potentially this question has already been covered, but in the response [13587], "following the reception of an indication from the AP MLD that there is no more boffered non-GCR-SP..." in the first part we define (precisely?) what "following" means (duration of EMLSR transition delay). Do you mean to apply the same duration to the second condition, or is "following" meaning some other (hopefully bounded) delay value?
Thanks
Ben


From: Gaurang Naik <gnaik@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2022 12:48 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted
 

Hi Vishnu,

 

Pls see the suggested change for CID 13587 as I mentioned during the call.

 

Also, there regarding the term ‘individually addressed’ in the resolution for CID 10434, I suggest making the following change to make the intention clear.

 

I believe you also made live changes during the call for CID 10434. Could you please upload the version with those changes?

 

Thanks,

Gaurang

 

 

From: Vishnu Ratnam <vishnu.r@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2022 11:34 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.

Dear all,

 

Thank you for discussion during the meeting on CR doc 1335 (Group addressed frame reception in EMLSR/NSTR). I summarize below the comments discussed on the call, and I look forward to additional feedback which was not discussed during the meeting:

  • CIDs 10434, 12813: The text “individually addressed frame exchanges“ may be inaccurate. The text “affiliated (non-MLO) upper MAC sublayer functions of the AP MLD (5.1.5.1 General ) served for the EMLSR links” is controversial. Recommended to delete: “non-AP MLD with dot11EHTEMLSROptionImplemented equal to true that is associated with an AP MLD with dot11EHTEMLSROptionImplemented equal to true” to simplify text.
  • CID 13587: Change the bullet to ensure that it doesn’t preclude listening operation on other EMLSR links when receiving group-addressed frames on one link, i.e., the return to listening operation is only for the STA that was receiving group-addressed frames. Also suggested to add that the return to listening is after the EMLSR transition delay.

 

Kindly let me know if I missed any of the comments on call. I would also appreciate if you can share feedback on CIDs which were not discussed during the meeting: [10039][10863][12726][12728][12892][13588][13813] and [10008][11594][13589].

 

Regards,

Vishnu

 

From: Vishnu Vardhan Ratnam <vishnu.r@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2022 2:28 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

Hi Xiangxin,

 

Please find my responses inline.

 

Regards,

Vishnu

 

From: 顾祥新 (Xiangxin Gu) <Xiangxin.Gu@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2022 9:14 PM
To: Vishnu Vardhan Ratnam <vishnu.r@xxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

Hi Vishnu,

 

Thanks for your response. I make inline reply.

 

BR,

 

Xiangxin Gu

Communication Standards Devision

 

 

From: Vishnu Ratnam <vishnu.r@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2022 12:19 AM
To: 顾祥新 (Xiangxin Gu) <Xiangxin.Gu@xxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

Hi Xiangxin,

 

Thank you for your comments and initiating the discussion.

  1. I personally don’t have a very strong opinion about this, i.e., is a capability indication by the AP MLD necessary or not. Others had suggested that a capability indication should be used during offline discussions. Without a capability indication, it may be unclear what the AP operation will be if an indication of group-link is provided by an EMLSR non-AP MLD, i.e., will it take action based on it or not.

[// Xiangxin Gu] If this mechanism is incorporated, there is no reason for an AP MLD not to support this because it make the AP MLD easier to operating with EMLSR/EMLMR mode. So I don’t understand why the capability indication is needed.

[VR] Since there are conflicting opinions on this, let us discuss this during the call to see what the group generally prefers. I would be happy to also collect other opinions of this as a response here to see which approach is more preferred.

 

  1. Beacon frames are also included in the list of group addressed frames. So even if no services are running over group-addressed data frames, the proposed mechanism is still required for protecting beacon frames. Can you elaborate further what case you are referring to and what is your suggestion?

[// Xiangxin Gu] Agree.

Further, an indication on whether there is services over group addressed frames other than Beacon frames at non-AP MLD side is suggested. Because it is gainful that the duration of transmission of these frames doesn’t need to be kept away from EML frame exchanges if no such services at non-AP MLD side. These frames occupy much more time than Beacon frame.

Moreover, for EMLMR, in case some RF chains are kept at the STAs on other links during the EML frame exchange, there is no need for EML frame exchanges to be away from the duration of transmission of group addressed frames on any links. For example, a multi-radio non-AP MLD with 3 affiliated STA1 and STA 2 and STA 3 setups link 1 and 2 and link 3 respectively with AP 1 and AP2 and AP3 affiliated with an AP MLD. All STAs support 2 SS. The non-AP MLD supports EMLMR mode, and has enabled EMLMR mode with 4 SS on link 1 and link 2 and link 3. The EMLMR mode does not use all RF chains of the non-AP MLD.

[VR] Regarding the indication of group addressed frame services, I see your point, But I think the issue may be that group addressed management frames are also buffered and transmitted after the DTIM beacon, and they can be meant for all non-AP MLDs. So even if a non-AP MLD is not subscribed to a group addressed service, it may want to decode the group addressed frames. Note that as of now there is no indication in TIM regarding whether the buffered group-addressed frames are data frames or management frames (there are some CIDs on that topic), so the non-AP MLD may not know if it can stop decoding.

Since many things regarding EMLMR are yet unclear, I removed the clause corresponding to EMLMR from the document. There are other CIDs for EMLMR section that can be used to extend this procedure for EMLMR. I encourage you to bring this idea up during the resolution of those CIDs.

 

  1. This point was also in debate in offline discussions, and two people suggested that the indication should be in a new EHT action frame. One of the reason is also that the indication of group link can be provided after switch to EMLSR mode, at any time. So reusing EML Operating Mode Notification frame might in fact reduce flexibility that the indication can only be provided when the switch to EMLSR mode happens. The EML Operating Mode Notification frame also has a response frame, while for this feature we don’t require a response frame from AP MLD. We can also have an offline discussion on this if you want a more detailed discussion.

[// Xiangxin Gu] Yes, we have to make decision for the tradeoff. Actually I doubt such flexibility make sense in practice.

[VR] Since there are conflicting opinions on this, let us discuss this during the call to see what the group generally prefers, I would be happy to also collect other opinions of this as a response here to preemptively see which option is more preferred.

 

Regards,

Vishnu

 

From: 顾祥新 (Xiangxin Gu) <Xiangxin.Gu@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2022 12:41 AM
To: Vishnu Vardhan Ratnam <vishnu.r@xxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

Hi Vishnu,

 

Thanks for the contribution document 22/1335r0, I have concerns:

  1. With this mechanism, the AP MLD get easier to operating with EMLSR/EMLMR mode. So it is unreasonable to have a capability item on this.
  2. The solution doesn’t cover the case that there is no services running over group addressed frames at non-AP MLD side.
  3. It’s better to put the information in EML Operating Notification frame, which consumes less steps and less signal overhead. I don’t think it’s a good idea to utilize an inefficient way just because we want to cover NSTR case. Actually no CID is related to NSTR. We can have a separate discussion on NSTR.

 

BR,

 

Xiangxin Gu

Communication Standards Devision

 

 

From: Vishnu Ratnam <vishnu.r@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2022 11:18 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

Hi Alfred,

 

Could you kindly add the following document to the MAC queue. It resolves 13 CIDs.

12-Aug-2022 ET

2022

1335

0

TGbe

CR for CIDs related to Group-addressed frame Reception in EMLSR/NSTR

Vishnu Ratnam (Samsung)

12-Aug-2022 11:13:05 ET

Download

 

In addition, I have uploaded the 1201r1 which is a PDT (in place of 1201r0 which was a ppt). As discussed, could you kindly move that document to the MAC Comment Resolution queue from the contribution queue? It resolves 1 CID.

12-Aug-2022 ET

2022

1201

1

TGbe

ML traffic indication using A-control

Vishnu Ratnam (Samsung)

12-Aug-2022 11:04:33 ET

Download

 

Thanking you,

Vishnu

 

From: Edward Au <edward.ks.au@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2022 6:52 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [STDS-802-11-TGBE] Latest comment spreadsheet on LB266 (11be D2.0) posted

 

Caution: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.

 

Dear Alfred and all,

 

Revision 16 of the comment spreadsheet is posted:

 

This version updated the status of selected CIDs after the motions on Wednesday, together with a few TTT assignments and PoC reassignment.

 

Regards,
Edward

To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-11-TGBE list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=STDS-802-11-TGBE&A=1

To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-11-TGBE list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=STDS-802-11-TGBE&A=1

This email (including its attachments) is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure. Unauthorized use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email or the information herein or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this email or the information herein, by anyone other than the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please do not read, copy, use or disclose any part of this e-mail to others. Please notify the sender immediately and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments if you received it in error. Internet communications cannot be guaranteed to be timely, secure, error-free or virus-free. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions.
本邮件及其附件具有保密性质，受法律保护不得泄露，仅发送给本邮件所指特定收件人。严禁非经授权使用、宣传、发布或复制本邮件或其内容。若非该特定收件人，请勿阅读、复制、 使用或披露本邮件的任何内容。若误收本邮件，请从系统中永久性删除本邮件及所有附件，并以回复邮件的方式即刻告知发件人。无法保证互联网通信及时、安全、无误或防毒。发件人对任何错漏均不承担责任。

This email (including its attachments) is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure. Unauthorized use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email or the information herein or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this email or the information herein, by anyone other than the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please do not read, copy, use or disclose any part of this e-mail to others. Please notify the sender immediately and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments if you received it in error. Internet communications cannot be guaranteed to be timely, secure, error-free or virus-free. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions.
本邮件及其附件具有保密性质，受法律保护不得泄露，仅发送给本邮件所指特定收件人。严禁非经授权使用、宣传、发布或复制本邮件或其内容。若非该特定收件人，请勿阅读、复制、 使用或披露本邮件的任何内容。若误收本邮件，请从系统中永久性删除本邮件及所有附件，并以回复邮件的方式即刻告知发件人。无法保证互联网通信及时、安全、无误或防毒。发件人对任何错漏均不承担责任。

To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-11-TGBE list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=STDS-802-11-TGBE&A=1

To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-11-TGBE list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=STDS-802-11-TGBE&A=1

To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-11-TGBE list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=STDS-802-11-TGBE&A=1

To unsubscribe from the STDS-802-11-TGBE list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=STDS-802-11-TGBE&A=1