Hi Chaoming and all,
Actually I see that Claudio has already added the Protected Sensing Action frame in
0235r1 :
So do we still need this motion? Ali has clarified that the only other thing needed in the specs is that a separate reply counter is defined for proteted sensing frame, which I believe can also be included during PDT writing without needing
explicit motion.
Regards,
Rojan
From: luochaoming@xxxxxxxx <000015d97e832564-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2022 4:07 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Hi Xiandong,
I think I have a previous SP (to run as motion #61) saying we need both public and protected action frames.
However, motion #61 does not decide whether the protected action frames use the "Protected Dual of Public Action" category or add a new category. This
new motion clarifies that we add a new category and the reason is to separate PN segment.
And I think the protected action frames are used by both associated and unassociated STAs.
BR,
Chaoming
Hi Chaoming,
My interpretation is that the key purpose of the ‘Protected Sensing Frame’ is defined to use for the measurement setup procedure, the sensing measurement and sensing result reporting procedure etc. especially by unassociated STA.
Best regards
Xiandong
发件人: luochaoming@xxxxxxxx <luochaoming@xxxxxxxx>
发送时间: 2022年2月11日 10:21
收件人: 董贤东 <dongxiandong@xxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
主题: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Hi Xiandong,
I do not quite get your point, could you explain more? Or do you have a suggestion for a better wording?
BR,
Chaoming
Hi all,
It seems that the only purpose of the ‘Protected Sensing Frame’ is defined to separate the PN segment, but actually it is not.
Best Regards
Xiandong Dong
发件人: luochaoming@xxxxxxxx <000015d97e832564-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
发送时间: 2022年2月11日 9:39
收件人: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
主题: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Hi Rojan and Ali,
Thanks Ali for the clarification, that's exactly the intention of the motion.
And Rojan, I don't have a better wording than "separate PN segment", so if you could suggest a better one, please do let me know, thanks very much. Or would "separate PN space" be better?
BR,
Chaoming
From: Ali Raissinia
Date: 2022-02-11 00:59
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
From standard point of view, we just need to define a different replay counter for Protected Sensing Frames- which essentially says it all.
Ali
From: Rojan Chitrakar <rojan.chitrakar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2022 8:40 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.
Hi Ali,
Thanks for the clarification, I understand the intention better and am fine if Chao Ming wants to keep it in the motion.
However, personally I would still think PN segmentation is an implementation specific solution; I don’t believe .11 spec needs to define it. As long as it is ensured that the PN is incremented for each new frame and never repeats, replay attacks are prevented.
Regards,
Rojan
From: Ali Raissinia <alirezar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2022 12:16 AM
To: Rojan Chitrakar <rojan.chitrakar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Once a device is associated, it derives a PTK and a corresponding PN sequence for packet transmissions (PN is coupled to PTK). Since frames are in general classified (i.e. TIDs) and sent out of order then for each classification a PN segment is assigned (i.e. PN=10000 to 50000) so that receiver can track and if needed detect a replay attack. The ‘Protected sensing frames’ cannot share the same PN segment as Protected Dual Public Action frames since they would need to be transmitted when TB/NTB measurement instant occurs regardless.
Regards,
Ali
From: Rojan Chitrakar <rojan.chitrakar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2022 7:34 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.
Hi Chao Ming,
I have a question regarding motion 2:
A new action category of robust ‘Protected Sensing Frame’ is defined to separate PN segment.
What is the meaning of “..to separate PN segment”? Is it necessary to include this in the motion? PNs are tied to the keys that are used to protect the frame; if the keys are different, the PN space will be automatically different as well.
Regards,
Rojan
From: luochaoming@xxxxxxxx <000015d97e832564-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2022 6:07 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Hi All,
I plan to run the following motions, and if you have any further comment or concern, please do send me an email, thanks!
Tony, please help to add the following two motion requests:
Motion 1, Ref: 22/0286r1, SP1 18Y/3N/15A
Move to add the following to the TGbf SFD:
- PASN for unassociated STA is used in sensing.
Motion 2, Ref: 22/0286r1, SP2 14Y/3N/18A
Move to add the following to the TGbf SFD:
•A new action category of robust ‘Protected Sensing Frame’ is defined to separate PN segment.
BR,
Chaoming
发送时间： 2022-02-10 17:51
主题： 答复: TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Hi Sang, Solomon,
AddedJ
Best Regards : )
Tony Xiao Han
发件人: Solomon Trainin [mailto:strainin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
发送时间: 2022年2月10日 17:13
收件人: Hanxiao (Tony, WT Lab) <tony.hanxiao@xxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
主题: RE: TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Hi Tony,
Please add to the agenda presentation of the 11-22-0243-01-00bf PDT DMG Sensing procedure (~30min)
Best regards,
Solomon Trainin
+972547885738
From: Hanxiao (Tony, WT Lab) <0000177ab8f731c4-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 5:23 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] 答复: TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.
Dear all,
After a long break, this is a reminder and call for submissions for the upcoming meeting on:
― February 7 (Monday), 9am - 11:00am ET
― February 8 (Tuesday), 9am - 11:00am ET
― February 10 (Thursday), 10pm - 12:00am ET
Agenda is posted: https://mentor.ieee.org/802.11/dcn/22/11-22-0232-00-00bf-tgbf-meeting-agenda-2022-02-03.pptx
Best Regards : )
Tony Xiao Han
发件人: Hanxiao (Tony, WT Lab) [mailto:0000177ab8f731c4-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
发送时间: 2022年1月29日 9:28
收件人: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
主题: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] TGbf meeting on February 7, 8, 10
Dear all,
This is a reminder and call for submissions for the upcoming meeting on:
― February 7 (Monday), 9am - 11:00am ET
― February 8 (Tuesday), 9am - 11:00am ET
― February 10 (Thursday), 10pm - 12:00am ET
Please note:
1. Please send the agenda request at least 24 hours prior to the call, following the format below:
• DCN, Title, Author (affiliation), Time duration
2.I will cancel the call if there is no request received 24 hours prior to a call.3. Please upload your submissions (revision 0) on mentor 24 hours prior to the meeting so that members would have a chance to review those submissions offline. Otherwise,
a. If there is not enough time during the meeting, the presentation will be delayed to the next meeting.
b. If there is enough time during the meeting, the presentation will be moved to the end of the queue and be presented in the end. However, any related SP should be delayed to the next meeting.
4. Please send the motion request (with related DCN, and SP result) around 10+5 days before the meeting (for teleconference, not for Plenary or Interim meeting), so that the TG chair could send the 10 day advance notice to the 802.11 reflector, after getting the approval from the WG chair.
5. Dial-in information:
February 7 (Monday)
Join the Webex meeting here: https://ieeesa.webex.com/ieeesa/j.php?MTID=m3f2fee6b1e77ddc9c9c784d35e040864
Meeting number: 233 704 78385
Meeting password: wireless (94735377 from phones and video systems)
Join by phone: Tap to call in from a mobile device (attendees only) +1-408-418-9388 USA Toll
Global call-in numbersAccess code: 233 704 78385
Join from a video system or application Dial 23370478385@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.
Join using Microsoft Lync or Microsoft Skype for Business Dial 23370478385.ieeesa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Need help? Go to http://help.webex.com
February 8 (Tuesday)
Join the Webex meeting here: https://ieeesa.webex.com/ieeesa/j.php?MTID=m864481d2520289545dda44964d1f86dcMeeting number: 234 974 30736
Meeting password: wireless (94735377 from phones and video systems)
Join by phone: Tap to call in from a mobile device (attendees only) +1-408-418-9388 USA Toll
Global call-in numbersAccess code: 234 974 30736
Join from a video system or application Dial 23497430736@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.
Join using Microsoft Lync or Microsoft Skype for Business Dial 23497430736.ieeesa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Need help? Go to http://help.webex.com
February 10 (Thursday)
Join the Webex meeting here: https://ieeesa.webex.com/ieeesa/j.php?MTID=mb411ded005feced31c88734b6664727f
Meeting number: 234 946 32217
Meeting password: wireless (94735377 from phones and video systems)
Join by phone: Tap to call in from a mobile device (attendees only) +1-408-418-9388 USA Toll
Global call-in numbersAccess code: 234 946 32217
Join from a video system or application Dial 23494632217@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.
Join using Microsoft Lync or Microsoft Skype for Business Dial 23494632217.ieeesa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Need help? Go to http://help.webex.com
Best Regards : )
Tony Xiao Han
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