Re: [STDS-802-11] Joint 802.1Qbz / 802.11ak additional technical issues
--- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Working Group Reflector ---
These are very definitely important topics. I've been working on the
document since the last meeting. I will upload it for all to look at at
the Dec. 17 meeting. Unfortunately, I will probably not be able to make
that meeting.
-- Norm
-----Original Message-----
From: Philippe Klein <philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wednesday, December 5, 2012 09:36 AM
To: Norman Finn <nfinn@xxxxxxxxx>, "STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"
<STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Joint 802.1Qbz / 802.11ak additional technical issues
>Norm,
>
>I think there are 2 additional technical issues for study that should be
>added to your presentation.
>
>In the P2P model the establishment of a Direct Link between 2 non-AP
>devices will modify the topology and requires protocol such RSTP to
>recalculate the spanning trees. My understanding is that Direct Link
>establishment and teardown could be quite dynamic and this could be an
>issue for "wired link " protocol which have been designed for more
>"stable" configurations.
>
>The second issue is the dynamic nature of the metrics of the wireless
>link (such BW, error rate, ... ) vs the bridging protocols designed for
>more static "wired links"...
>
>/Philippe
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Norman Finn (nfinn) [mailto:nfinn@xxxxxxxxx]
>Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2012 11:15 PM
>To: Philippe Klein; STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>Subject: Re: [802.1 - 9376] MC reflection problem
>
>For everyone's benefit, Philippe and I got this straightened out at the
>phone meeting. The AP has to do something different than it does, today
>so that the non-AP station can discard reflected frames and not present
>them to the attached bridge function. I updated the slides to make sure
>there is no confusion.
>
>-- Norm
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Philippe Klein <philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Date: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 01:19 AM
>To: Norman Finn <nfinn@xxxxxxxxx>, "STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"
><STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Subject: RE: [802.1 - 9376] MC reflection problem
>
>>Norm,
>>
>>Thank you for your answer. I still believe that the prevention of the MC
>>reflection is a function of the 802.11 AP "entity" rather than the 802.1
>>bridge "entity".
>>Having said that, it might well be that our "difference" of view is
>>semantic only i.e. we do not envision the same functional boundary
>>between the AP and bridge entities. This is a point we could address and
>>resolve during the January interim.
>>
>>Sincerely /Philippe
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Norman Finn (nfinn) [mailto:nfinn@xxxxxxxxx]
>>Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 2:50 AM
>>To: Philippe Klein; STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Subject: Re: [802.1 - 9376] MC reflection problem
>>
>>Philippe,
>>
>>Yes, the AP receives the frames on two different interfaces. The problem
>>is with Bridge B. Right now, the frame transmitted by the AP in both
>>cases, that is, no matter on which interface is was received, is exactly
>>the same. That's the problem. The AP *could* easily do something to
>>distinguish the frames, so that Bridge B would know what to do. The
>>question is, exactly how does the AP mark the two different cases?
>>That's
>>the problem I'm challenging 802.11 to solve.
>>
>>-- Norm
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Philippe Klein <philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>Reply-To: Philippe Klein <philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>Date: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 06:53 AM
>>To: "STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <STDS-802-1-L@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>Subject: [802.1 - 9376] MC reflection problem
>>
>>>802.1 list help: www.ieee802.org/1/email-pages/zuwz1011.html
>>>List archives (access-controlled) by thread:
>>> www.ieee802.org/1/private/email2/thrd1.html
>>>-----
>>>
>>>Norm,
>>>
>>>In the presentation you made at the San Antonio meeting (cf
>>>http://www.ieee802.org/1/files/public/docs2012/bz-nfinn-reflection-probl
>>>e
>>>m
>>>-1012-v1.pdf) you mentioned in slide 8 that
>>>
>>> "Bridge B doesn't know whether to discard the frame (the correct action
>>>in Case 1) or to forward it and learn X's new location (the correct
>>>action in Case 2); it cannot distinguish the two cases."
>>>
>>>While I obviously agree with the scenario (spanning tree has changed)
>>>presented in slide 6, I do not see an indetermination issue between the
>>>two frames as the AP receives these frames on 2 different interfaces
>>>(the
>>>wireless one in case 1 and the DS interface in case 2) and could
>>>therefore easily discriminate between them.
>>>
>>>It is true that the "Bridge B" cannot discriminate but in my humble
>>>opinion filtering out of the reflected MCs is a service internal to the
>>>BSS and not a function of the bridge.
>>>
>>>Could you please comment on this.
>>>
>>>Cordially /Philippe
>>>
>>>
>>>Philippe Klein, PhD | Associate Technical Director, Broadband Technology
>>>Group
>>>Broadcom Corporation | Golan House, P.O.Box 273, Airport City, 70100
>>>Israel
>>>(M) +972 54 313 4500 | philippe@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>>===
>>>Unsubscribe link: mailto:STDS-802-1-L-SIGNOFF-REQUEST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>IEEE. Fostering technological innovation and excellence for the benefit
>>>of humanity.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
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