Re: [STDS-802-16] [802SEC] +++EC Email Ballot+++ENDS 4 SEPT+++ 802.4 Disband Motion+++tally update
I've read through a lot of discussion on this issue, but I haven't
found most of it to be very helpful in deciding my vote.
I think that the P&P make it clear that a hibernating WG whose
standards are withdrawn should be disbanded. After all, if the ballot
to disband fails, the Chair "shall determine a future date when the
disbanding of the group will be reballoted." Which means we'll have
to keep balloting the question until we pass it.
Therefore, my vote simply depends on whether or not I agree with the
"whereas" statement in the motion, which states that 802.4 "no longer
has any active standards."
The problem is that I can't tell. The IEEE Standards Status Report
says that 8802-4-1990 and 15802-4-1994 have the status of "Approved
Publication of IEEE." I think this means that they have not been
withdrawn (although I don't understand why not).
So, I plan to vote Disapprove. However, I'll vote Approve if someone
can convince me that these two standards are actually no longer
active.
Roger
At 11:44 -0400 2004-08-13, Paul Nikolich wrote:
>I noticed I did have the correct tally in the first email, this one
>corrects it.
>--Paul
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <mailto:paul.nikolich@ATT.NET>Paul Nikolich
>To: <mailto:STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org>STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org
>Sent: Friday, August 13, 2004 10:53 AM
>Subject: [802SEC] +++EC Email Ballot+++ENDS 4 SEPT+++ Disbanding of
>802.4+++tally update
>
>Dear EC members,
>
>The below email ballot closes 5pm edt 4Sept 2004. The tentative
>tally for the below motion is
>07 Approve
>01 Disapprove
>06 Did Not Vote
>01 Abstains
>
>Please remember to cast your vote (or if I did not record it
>correctly below, send me a correction note.)
>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul Nikolich
>
>
>Vote categories: DIS DNV APP ABS
> -----------------------------------------------
> 01 Mat Sherman= APP
> 02 Howard Frazier' DNV
> 03 Buzz Rigsbee= DIS
> 04 Bob O'Hara= ABS
> 05 John Hawkins= APP
> 06 Tony Jeffree- APP
> 07 Bob Grow= APP
> 08 Stuart Kerry. DNV
> 09 Bob Heile DNV
> 10 Roger Marks. DNV
> 11 Mike Takefman. DNV
> 12 Carl Stevenson= APP
> 13 Steve Shellhammer= APP
> 14 Jerry Upton= APP
> 15 Ajay Rajkumar. DNV
> ---++++---+++++---++++---
> TOTALS DIS DNV APP ABS
> total: -01- -06- -07- -01-
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <mailto:paul.nikolich@ATT.NET>Paul Nikolich
>To: <mailto:STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
>Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 4:17 PM
>Subject: [802SEC] +++EC Email Ballot+++ENDS 4 SEPT+++ Disbanding of 802.4
>
>Dear EC members,
>
>I am withdrawing the original disbanding of 802.4 and 802.9 motion
>on behalf of the mover and seconder and replacing it with two
>motions, one to disband 802.4 and one to disband 802.9.
>
>This is a 30 day email ballot to make a determination on the following motion:
>
>Whereas 802.4 is in hibernation and no longer has any active
>standards I move to to disband 802.4 per Clause 7.2.5.1 of our P&P."
>Moved: Mat Sherman, Second: Tony Jeffree
>
>The ballot opens 04August 2004 5pm edt and closes 04September 2004 5pm edt.
>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul Nikolich
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <mailto:paul.nikolich@ATT.NET>Paul Nikolich
>To: <mailto:STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
>Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 1:03 PM
>Subject: [802SEC] +++EC Email Ballot+++ENDS 4 SEPT+++ Disbanding of
>802.4 and 802.9
>
>Dear EC Members,
>
>This is a 30 day email ballot to make a determination on the following motion:
>
>Motion:
>Whereas 802.4 and 802.9 are in hibernation and no longer appear to
>have any active standards, per Clause 7.2.5.1 of our P&P I'd like to
>request a 30 day electronic ballot of the EC on a motion to disband
>802.4 and 802.9.
>
>The ballot opens 04August 2004 1pm edt and closes 04September 2004 1pm edt.
>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul Nikolich
>
>
>PLEASE NOTE THE BELOW:
>I have contacted the chairs of the hibernating 802.4 and 802.9
>Working Groups, Paul Eastman and Dhadesugoor Vaman to get their
>input on the disbanding of their Working Groups. They have also
>been copied on this email ballot. On behalf of the entire LMSC, I
>wish to thank Paul and Dhadesugoor for their time and energy they
>have spent over the years in leading their respective projects.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Vaman concurs with the disbanding action and his response to my
>inquiry was as follows:
>
>"Dear Paul:
>Greetings. I think you should go ahead with the plans for
>disbandment of IEEE 802.9. I do not think that any body has any
>problems, since the group has not met for many years.
>[irrelevant text deleted]...
>Best regards
>Vaman
>(T) 301-514-7880"
><mailto:vaman@sbcglobal.net>vaman@sbcglobal.net
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Paul Eastman disagrees with the disbanding action and his response
>to my inquiry was as follows:
>
>"I disagreed with the disbanding in 2000 (or 2001) and I still
>disagree. These standards are still in use in isolated
>applications. I also believe that these old standards should have
>the right to protect their legacy. Under the current rules, there
>is no method for such protection. I know that I am in a very small
>minority regarding my opinion but I am not about to roll over in
>bowing to the majority. I will abide by the majority but will
>maintain my opinion. I do not remember when (other than 2000 or
>2001) 802.4 was disbanded.
>
>-- Paul Eastman"
><mailto:paul@rfnetworks.com>paul@rfnetworks.com
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <mailto:paul.nikolich@ATT.NET>Paul Nikolich
>To: <mailto:STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org>STDS-802-SEC@listserv.ieee.org
>Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2004 9:04 AM
>Subject: [802SEC] Disbanding of 802.4 and 802.9
>
>Dear EC members,
>
>There has been a motion to disband 802.4 and 802.9, made by Mat
>Sherman and seconded by Tony Jeffree as shown below:
>
>Motion:
>Whereas 802.4 and 802.9 are in hibernation and no longer appear to
>have any active standards, per Clause 7.2.5.1 of our P&P I'd like to
>request a 30 day electronic ballot of the EC on a motion to disband
>802.4 and 802.9.
>
>Before I initiate the formal email ballot, I will attempt to get the
>chairs of the hibernating working groups to confirm they agree with
>this action (Paul Eastman, 802.4 and Dhadesugoor Vaman, 802.9.) over
>the next several days. I have copied Paul Eastman on this email. I
>don't have a current email for Vaman, so I've also copied John Boal,
>who I believe is in contact with Vaman and can notify him of our
>plans.
>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul Nikolich
>
>
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>---------- This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email
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