RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna Diversity
Joann, Bob:
Yep, I like that.
Dave James
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org
[mailto:owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org] On Behalf Of
Joanne Wilson
Sent: 07 November 2003 14:36
To: Robert D. Love; Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]; Michael Youssefmir; Rausch,
Walter F [GMG]
Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)
Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
Diversity
Bob,
I see your point. How about the following variation that I think addresses
all concerns?
"The Base Station should provide antenna diversity, which may be an integral
part of an advanced antenna solution. The standard shall neither require
nor preclude the use of antenna diversity at the mobile stations."
Best regards,
Joanne
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert D. Love [mailto:rdlove@nc.rr.com]
Sent: Friday, November 07, 2003 8:58 AM
To: Joanne Wilson; Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]; Michael Youssefmir; Rausch,
Walter F [GMG]
Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)
Subject: Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
Diversity
Joanne, with regard to your proposed words
"The Base Station should provide antenna diversity, which may be an integral
part of an advanced antenna solution. Antenna diversity shall not be a
requirement of the mobile station."
I present for consideration a change of the second sentence above to "The
standard shall not preclude the capability of antenna diversity for the
mobile stations."
This softer wording would allow for a mix of solutions, some of which might
require antenna diversity. It would, however, leave available, the
possibility of meeting some of the market requirements with mobile stations
lacking antenna diversity.
Best regards,
Robert D. Love
President, LAN Connect Consultants
7105 Leveret Circle Raleigh, NC 27615
Phone: 919 848-6773 Mobile: 919 810-7816
email: rdlove@ieee.org Fax: 208 978-1187
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joanne Wilson" <joanne@arraycomm.com>
To: "Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]" <JHumbe01@sprintspectrum.com>; "Michael
Youssefmir" <mike@arraycomm.com>; "Rausch, Walter F [GMG]"
<walter.f.rausch@mail.sprint.com>
Cc: "! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)" <stds-80220-requirements@ieee.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 10:43 PM
Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
Diversity
>
> John,
> Walter,
>
> Your arguments about the economics of deploying diversity do not address
> the issue at hand. Many people agree that different markets have
different
> requirements and the added cost of diversity may not be appropriate or
> necessary for all markets. Certainly, as an operator, you can require
> that your equipment
> vendors implement receive diversity in their base stations and/or mobile
> stations. It doesn't seem either appropriate or necessary for the
standard
> to mandate receive diversity, particularly in the mobile terminal. If
> the economics are as you suggest, then it will certainly be available
> without having to mandate it in the standard. My preference would be
> to either delete this section or to use the following which is close
> to one of the options
in
> the
> document:
>
> The Base Station should provide antenna diversity, which may be an
> integral part of an advanced antenna solution. Antenna diversity shall
> not be a requirement of the mobile station.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Joanne
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org
> [mailto:owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of
> Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]
> Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 1:46 PM
> To: Michael Youssefmir; Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)
> Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11
> Antenna Diversity
>
>
>
> The economics of deploying diversity are very positive just look at
> the number of air interface technologies that support diversity i.e.
> CDMA, GSM, IS-136.
>
>
> John J. Humbert
> 6220 Sprint Parkway
> Mailstop KSOPHD0504 - 5D276
> Overland Park, KS 66251-6118
> PCS (816) 210-9611
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org
> [mailto:owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org] On Behalf Of
> Michael Youssefmir
> Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 10:10 AM
> To: Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail); Michael Youssefmir
> Subject: Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11
> Antenna Diversity
>
>
>
> Hi Walter,
>
> I now undertsand what your preface "At a minimum" means. Essentially
> you are mandating receive diversity. So I think we are back to square
> one on this issue. As the current revision of the document shows there
> is substantial disagreement in the wider group on this topic. I don't
> see how your new text really resolves any of this. I will just
> reiterate my opposition for any requirement that mandates the use of
> diversity (specifically at the user terminal) for the reasons stated
> in our previous lengthy discussion: Market needs vary for many reasons
> in different places and with different market segments, often
> requiring tradeoffs between performance, cost and other factors like
> terminal size. Therefore, terminals with single antennas should be
> allowed.
>
> Mike
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 06, 2003 at 09:06:25AM -0600, Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> wrote:
> > Mike,
> >
> > In 4.1.11, prefaced the requirement statement with, "At a minimum",
> > as
> an encouragement to all manufacturers to provide as robust an airlink
> as possible. Stated this way, any standards compatible AI will at
> least offer RX diversity, but no vendor is prevented from providing
> more advanced techniques.
> >
> > Section 4.1.10 remands manufacturers to provide attachment points
> within the PHY/MAC for the use of advanced antenna technologies,
> either within his own product offering, or as upgrades at some future
> date. Such upgrades may be provided by third parties, and may use
> techniques that were unavailable when the original equipment was
> manufactured.
> >
> > Walter Rausch
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Michael Youssefmir [mailto:mike@arraycomm.com]
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2003 8:34 PM
> > To: Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> > Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail); Michael Youssefmir
> > Subject: Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11
> > Antenna Diversity
> >
> >
> > Hi Walter,
> >
> > I have a couple comments regarding your proposed text:
> >
> > > 4 .1.11 Antenna Diversity
> > > At a minimum, the Air Interface shall provide support for receive
> diversity.
> >
> > I think we should remove the text "At a minimum" as it provides
> > little information.
> >
> > Also can you please clarify your proposal itself. For example, it is
> > not completely clear what is being mandated and how this contributes
> > more beyond section 4.1.10:
> >
> > 4.1.10 Support for Multi Antenna Capabilities (Closed)
> >
> > Interconnectivity at the PHY/MAC will be provided at the Base
> > Station
> and/or the Mobile Terminal for advanced multi antenna technologies to
> achieve higher effective data rates, user capacity, cell sizes and
> reliability. As an example, MIMO.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 02:55:11PM -0600, Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> wrote:
> > >
> > > 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna Diversity
> > >
> > >
> > > Current Text (and comments)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Editors Note: there are two versions of this section and there are
> numerous proponents for deleting this section. <?xml:namespace prefix
> = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
> > >
> > > At a minimum, both the Base Station and the Mobile Terminal shall
> provide two element diversity. Diversity may be an integral part of an
> advanced antenna solution.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > The Base Station shall provide antenna diversity. Diversity may be
> an integral part of an advanced antenna solution. Antenna diversity
> shall not be a requirement of the mobile station.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Proposed Text change.
> > >
> > > 4 .1.11 Antenna Diversity
> > >
> > >
> > > At a minimum, the Air Interface shall provide support for receive
> diversity.
> > >
> > > Rational
> > >
> > > Multiple antenna diversity at it's simplest provides known gain
> > > for
> minimal hardware and development efforts. The vendor community is free
> to work within these guidelines to provide the most cost-effective
> implementation.
> > >
> > >
> > > Walter Rausch
> > > Principal Network Evolution Planner
> > > Sprint Broadband
> > > 6360 Sprint Parkway, Bldg. 5
> > > MS: KSOPHE0310-3A350
> > > Overland Park, KS 66251
> > > walter.f.rausch@mail.sprint.com
> > > Voice: 913-762-1598
> > > FAX: 913-762-0506
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
>