Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna Diversity
I, too, can accept Joanne's proposed wording.
Best regards,
Robert D. Love
President, LAN Connect Consultants
7105 Leveret Circle Raleigh, NC 27615
Phone: 919 848-6773 Mobile: 919 810-7816
email: rdlove@ieee.org Fax: 208 978-1187
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave James (Oak Global, via i2roam)" <djames@oak-global.com>
To: "'Joanne Wilson'" <joanne@arraycomm.com>; "'Robert D. Love'"
<rdlove@nc.rr.com>; "'Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]'"
<JHumbe01@sprintspectrum.com>; "'Michael Youssefmir'" <mike@arraycomm.com>;
"'Rausch, Walter F [GMG]'" <walter.f.rausch@mail.sprint.com>
Cc: "'! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)'"
<stds-80220-requirements@ieee.org>
Sent: Friday, November 07, 2003 11:45 AM
Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
Diversity
>
> Joann, Bob:
> Yep, I like that.
> Dave James
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org
> [mailto:owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org] On Behalf Of
> Joanne Wilson
> Sent: 07 November 2003 14:36
> To: Robert D. Love; Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]; Michael Youssefmir;
Rausch,
> Walter F [GMG]
> Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)
> Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
> Diversity
>
>
>
> Bob,
>
> I see your point. How about the following variation that I think
addresses
> all concerns?
>
> "The Base Station should provide antenna diversity, which may be an
integral
> part of an advanced antenna solution. The standard shall neither require
> nor preclude the use of antenna diversity at the mobile stations."
>
> Best regards,
>
> Joanne
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert D. Love [mailto:rdlove@nc.rr.com]
> Sent: Friday, November 07, 2003 8:58 AM
> To: Joanne Wilson; Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]; Michael Youssefmir;
Rausch,
> Walter F [GMG]
> Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)
> Subject: Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
> Diversity
>
>
> Joanne, with regard to your proposed words
> "The Base Station should provide antenna diversity, which may be an
integral
> part of an advanced antenna solution. Antenna diversity shall not be a
> requirement of the mobile station."
>
> I present for consideration a change of the second sentence above to "The
> standard shall not preclude the capability of antenna diversity for the
> mobile stations."
>
> This softer wording would allow for a mix of solutions, some of which
might
> require antenna diversity. It would, however, leave available, the
> possibility of meeting some of the market requirements with mobile
stations
> lacking antenna diversity.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Robert D. Love
> President, LAN Connect Consultants
> 7105 Leveret Circle Raleigh, NC 27615
> Phone: 919 848-6773 Mobile: 919 810-7816
> email: rdlove@ieee.org Fax: 208 978-1187
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joanne Wilson" <joanne@arraycomm.com>
> To: "Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]" <JHumbe01@sprintspectrum.com>; "Michael
> Youssefmir" <mike@arraycomm.com>; "Rausch, Walter F [GMG]"
> <walter.f.rausch@mail.sprint.com>
> Cc: "! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)"
<stds-80220-requirements@ieee.org>
> Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 10:43 PM
> Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna
> Diversity
>
>
> >
> > John,
> > Walter,
> >
> > Your arguments about the economics of deploying diversity do not address
> > the issue at hand. Many people agree that different markets have
> different
> > requirements and the added cost of diversity may not be appropriate or
> > necessary for all markets. Certainly, as an operator, you can require
> > that your equipment
> > vendors implement receive diversity in their base stations and/or mobile
> > stations. It doesn't seem either appropriate or necessary for the
> standard
> > to mandate receive diversity, particularly in the mobile terminal. If
> > the economics are as you suggest, then it will certainly be available
> > without having to mandate it in the standard. My preference would be
> > to either delete this section or to use the following which is close
> > to one of the options
> in
> > the
> > document:
> >
> > The Base Station should provide antenna diversity, which may be an
> > integral part of an advanced antenna solution. Antenna diversity shall
> > not be a requirement of the mobile station.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Joanne
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org
> > [mailto:owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of
> > Humbert, John J [NTWK SVCS]
> > Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 1:46 PM
> > To: Michael Youssefmir; Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> > Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail)
> > Subject: RE: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11
> > Antenna Diversity
> >
> >
> >
> > The economics of deploying diversity are very positive just look at
> > the number of air interface technologies that support diversity i.e.
> > CDMA, GSM, IS-136.
> >
> >
> > John J. Humbert
> > 6220 Sprint Parkway
> > Mailstop KSOPHD0504 - 5D276
> > Overland Park, KS 66251-6118
> > PCS (816) 210-9611
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org
> > [mailto:owner-stds-80220-requirements@majordomo.ieee.org] On Behalf Of
> > Michael Youssefmir
> > Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 10:10 AM
> > To: Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> > Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail); Michael Youssefmir
> > Subject: Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11
> > Antenna Diversity
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Walter,
> >
> > I now undertsand what your preface "At a minimum" means. Essentially
> > you are mandating receive diversity. So I think we are back to square
> > one on this issue. As the current revision of the document shows there
> > is substantial disagreement in the wider group on this topic. I don't
> > see how your new text really resolves any of this. I will just
> > reiterate my opposition for any requirement that mandates the use of
> > diversity (specifically at the user terminal) for the reasons stated
> > in our previous lengthy discussion: Market needs vary for many reasons
> > in different places and with different market segments, often
> > requiring tradeoffs between performance, cost and other factors like
> > terminal size. Therefore, terminals with single antennas should be
> > allowed.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Nov 06, 2003 at 09:06:25AM -0600, Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> > wrote:
> > > Mike,
> > >
> > > In 4.1.11, prefaced the requirement statement with, "At a minimum",
> > > as
> > an encouragement to all manufacturers to provide as robust an airlink
> > as possible. Stated this way, any standards compatible AI will at
> > least offer RX diversity, but no vendor is prevented from providing
> > more advanced techniques.
> > >
> > > Section 4.1.10 remands manufacturers to provide attachment points
> > within the PHY/MAC for the use of advanced antenna technologies,
> > either within his own product offering, or as upgrades at some future
> > date. Such upgrades may be provided by third parties, and may use
> > techniques that were unavailable when the original equipment was
> > manufactured.
> > >
> > > Walter Rausch
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Michael Youssefmir [mailto:mike@arraycomm.com]
> > > Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2003 8:34 PM
> > > To: Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> > > Cc: ! Stds-80220-Requirements (E-mail); Michael Youssefmir
> > > Subject: Re: stds-80220-requirements: 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11
> > > Antenna Diversity
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Walter,
> > >
> > > I have a couple comments regarding your proposed text:
> > >
> > > > 4 .1.11 Antenna Diversity
> > > > At a minimum, the Air Interface shall provide support for receive
> > diversity.
> > >
> > > I think we should remove the text "At a minimum" as it provides
> > > little information.
> > >
> > > Also can you please clarify your proposal itself. For example, it is
> > > not completely clear what is being mandated and how this contributes
> > > more beyond section 4.1.10:
> > >
> > > 4.1.10 Support for Multi Antenna Capabilities (Closed)
> > >
> > > Interconnectivity at the PHY/MAC will be provided at the Base
> > > Station
> > and/or the Mobile Terminal for advanced multi antenna technologies to
> > achieve higher effective data rates, user capacity, cell sizes and
> > reliability. As an example, MIMO.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Oct 31, 2003 at 02:55:11PM -0600, Rausch, Walter F [GMG]
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > 802.20 Requirements: 4.1.11 Antenna Diversity
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Current Text (and comments)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Editors Note: there are two versions of this section and there are
> > numerous proponents for deleting this section. <?xml:namespace prefix
> > = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
> > > >
> > > > At a minimum, both the Base Station and the Mobile Terminal shall
> > provide two element diversity. Diversity may be an integral part of an
> > advanced antenna solution.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The Base Station shall provide antenna diversity. Diversity may be
> > an integral part of an advanced antenna solution. Antenna diversity
> > shall not be a requirement of the mobile station.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Proposed Text change.
> > > >
> > > > 4 .1.11 Antenna Diversity
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > At a minimum, the Air Interface shall provide support for receive
> > diversity.
> > > >
> > > > Rational
> > > >
> > > > Multiple antenna diversity at it's simplest provides known gain
> > > > for
> > minimal hardware and development efforts. The vendor community is free
> > to work within these guidelines to provide the most cost-effective
> > implementation.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Walter Rausch
> > > > Principal Network Evolution Planner
> > > > Sprint Broadband
> > > > 6360 Sprint Parkway, Bldg. 5
> > > > MS: KSOPHE0310-3A350
> > > > Overland Park, KS 66251
> > > > walter.f.rausch@mail.sprint.com
> > > > Voice: 913-762-1598
> > > > FAX: 913-762-0506
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>