Re: [802.3_ISAAC] [EXT] Re: [802.3_ISAAC] Comment on presentation today

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Subject: Re: [802.3_ISAAC] [EXT] Re: [802.3_ISAAC] Comment on presentation today

From: Ragnar Jonsson <rjonsson@xxxxxxxxxxx>

Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2024 18:49:44 +0000

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Reply-to: Ragnar Jonsson <rjonsson@xxxxxxxxxxx>

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Thread-topic: [EXT] Re: [802.3_ISAAC] Comment on presentation today

Hi Mehmet,

My takeaway from German’s and Ahmed’s presentation today was that 25Gbps is clearly theoretically feasible over 15m coax. The presentation was not completely clear on the assumed transmit signal level, but my understanding is that it was either -3dBm or -6dBm. For comparison, 802.3ch and 802.3cy both assumed that the transmit power would be around 0dBm. If we would increase the transmit power by 3dB or 6dB, the SNR margin in the presentation become positive. Further increase in transmit power should result in even higher SNR. So theoretically, 25Gbps is possible over the channel in German’s and Ahmad’s presentation.

Ragnar

From: Mehmet Tazebay <00002b0d1a6e9d74-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2024 10:35 AM
To: STDS-802-3-ISAAC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [EXT] Re: [802.3_ISAAC] Comment on presentation today

External Email

Hi Ariel,

That is not entirely correct. The ASA spec was made available to 802.3 working group. Also, we have seen today that 25Gbps is not theoretically feasible over a typical 17m coax channel even without automotive noise conditions, aging, temperature effects and etc. Therefore, I’d question the technical feasibility of 32Gbps over the target (15m?) length without seeing a proof.

Thanks,

Mehmet

On Jan 9, 2024, at 10:13 AM, Ariel Lasry <00002b0585801bb1-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Hi Mehmet,

You are correct. The A-PHY v2.0 is not publicly available.

This is the same as for all the other SerDes mentioned in the presentation of Conrad.

The point of Ragnar’s question was about the trend in support for higher data rates for example with A-PHY 32Gbps.

To this Conrad replied that 32Gbps was realized with 2 Lanes with A-PHY.

Which is correct for A-PHY v1.1 with STQ cable.

To that I have just added the comment that from A-PHY v2.0, 32Gbps is supported over a single Lane over Coax or STP cable.

That is all.

Thanks

Ariel

From: Mehmet Tazebay <00002b0d1a6e9d74-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2024 6:56 PM
To: STDS-802-3-ISAAC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [802.3_ISAAC] Comment on presentation today

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Hi Ariel,

Thank you for the information. However, I think the white paper is not a sufficient condition as it only defines the features of the technology but not the technical details. I believe that the standard and technical details of APHY 2.0 are not publicly available, correct? If so, how can we review and discuss the technical feasibility of 32Gbps as it is claimed in the white paper?

Thanks,

Mehmet

On Jan 9, 2024, at 7:09 AM, Ariel Lasry <00002b0585801bb1-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Hi all,

comments on Conrad’s presentation today on the 32Gbps A-PHY, since there was a question on that topic.

In A-PHY v2.0 it is on a single Coax or STP.

Reference: MIPI White Paper: Introduction to MASS

Thanks

Ariel

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