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Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

I will forward.

 

 

Chad Jones

Technical Leader, Cisco Systems

Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force

Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3

 

 

From: "Stewart, Heath" <Heath.Stewart@xxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: "Stewart, Heath" <Heath.Stewart@xxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thursday, September 2, 2021 at 11:17 AM
To: PDCC <STDS-802-3-PDCC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

 

Maybe

 

A valid load (PD) that has been positively identified and verified by the PSE and according to a specification.

 

Heath

 

 

From: George Zimmerman <george@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, September 2, 2021 7:58 AM
To: STDS-802-3-PDCC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

 

[External]

 

Chad – if the PSE verifies that there is a resistor there, does that make it ok?  It seems we want something more like ‘identified and verified according to a specification as being suitable for the PSE.’

 

From: Chad Jones (cmjones) <00000b60b3f54e8d-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, September 2, 2021 7:47 AM
To: STDS-802-3-PDCC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

 

here’s what we came up with:

 

qualified load

A load (PD) that has been verified by the PSE

 

 

 

Chad Jones

Technical Leader, Cisco Systems

Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force

Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3

 

 

From: "Chad Jones (cmjones)" <00000b60b3f54e8d-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: Chad Jones <cmjones@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thursday, September 2, 2021 at 10:30 AM
To: PDCC <STDS-802-3-PDCC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

 

One problem with our definition: now we need a definition of ‘qualified load’. if anyone has thoughts, I’d love to hear them.

 

 

Chad Jones

Technical Leader, Cisco Systems

Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force

Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3

 

 

From: "thompson@xxxxxxxx" <thompson@xxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: "thompson@xxxxxxxx" <thompson@xxxxxxxx>
Date: Thursday, September 2, 2021 at 8:33 AM
To: PDCC <stds-802-3-pdcc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Chad Jones <cmjones@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: Geoff Thompson <thompson@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

 

Chad-

 

I have always considered that being made up of only passive components was a major requirement for our qualification circuit from Day 1 (You can check with Steve on this if you like).  Of course, I can't speak for USB and know exceedingly little about its details.

 

Geoff

 

On Thursday, September 2, 2021, 05:07:00 AM PDT, Chad Jones (cmjones) <cmjones@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

 

 

Geoff, the USB folks won’t accept the addition of passive on front of load as the USB load is not passive in their process. I will pose this to the USB group this AM.

 

thanks!

 

 

Chad Jones

Technical Leader, Cisco Systems

Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force

Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3

 

 

From: "thompson@xxxxxxxx" <thompson@xxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: "thompson@xxxxxxxx" <thompson@xxxxxxxx>
Date: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 at 8:34 PM
To: PDCC <stds-802-3-pdcc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Chad Jones <cmjones@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: Geoff Thompson <thompson@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [802.3_PDCC] Offline work on a definition, continuation of 9/1 meeting

 

Chad/All-

 

My contribution shown in green

 

 

CLEAN VERSION:

Non-Static Power Source (NSPS)

A PSE that is only capable of outputting maximum rated power when connected to a qualified load, where the PSE actively qualifies the load. An NSPS has the following characteristics:

  • The PSE maximum rated output power is not available into an open circuit
  • The PSE is limited to ES1, PS1 into an open circuit or a non-qualified load
  • The PSE requires a specific passive load (e.g. electronically encoded ID), protocol, and/or software to enable the PSE rated output
  • The PSE removes maximum rated power when the qualified load is removed
  • The PSE returns to the non-powered state when in fault
  • Special test equipment will be needed to enable the PSE output.

 

A PSE will not provide power beyond ES1, PS1 limits into circuits providing any of the following conditions:

  • The PSE is subjected to a short circuit of its output.
  • The PSE is subjected to a larger load than its maximum output.  The current will fold back to a lesser value.
  • The PSE is subjected to a short to ground of either of its output terminals.

 

I hope this helps or is at least a start.

 

Geoff

On Wednesday, September 1, 2021, 12:21:40 PM PDT, Chad Jones (cmjones) <00000b60b3f54e8d-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxx> wrote:

 

 

As discussed in today’s PDCC call, here is the initial markup of the NSPS definition. I’ve annotated with strikethrough and underline to show the changes and put my comments in (parenthesis). Since this is messy, I’ve pasted a clean final version at the bottom. recall we stated that the definition should: “what qualifies to turn it on, what qualifies to keep it going, what qualifies to turn it off. Then list what it doesn’t operate into.” I’m not coming up with things to state in the what it doesn’t do part. Looking for suggestions.

 

Non-Static Power Source (NSPS)

A PSE that is only capable of outputting maximum rated power when connected to a qualified load, where the PSE actively qualifies the load. An NSPS has the following characteristics:

  • The PSE maximum rated output voltage power is not available into an open circuit
  • The PSE is limited to ES1, PS1 into an open circuit or a non-qualified load
  • The PSE maximum rated output power (voltage and/or current) is not available when connected to a resistive or non-capacitive load. (deleted this because of the qualified load statemen, no longer needed).
  • The PSE requires a specific load (e.g. electronically encoded ID), protocol, and/or software to enable the PSE rated output power (voltage and/or current).
  • The PSE sends periodic voltage pulses to check for valid PD impedance signature before enabling rated output power (voltage and/or current). (covered by qualified load).
  • The PSE is capable of producing different output power (voltage and/or current) ranges dependent on the PD connected, in accordance with communication power specification. (don’t see this as important to the concept. most important is detection of the PD before applying power. having different classes of PDs isn’t paramount, just an added bonus).
  • The PSE requires handshaking/negotiation between the PSE and PD before DC output power is made available by the PSE. (covered by qualified load).
  • The PSE supports intelligent fault managed technologies. (also covered by qualified load).
  • The PSE removes maximum rated power when the qualified load is removed
  • The PSE returns to the non-powered state when in fault
  • Special test equipment may will be needed to enable the PSE output or induce faults.

 

An NSPS does not:

what we got?

 

CLEAN VERSION:

Non-Static Power Source (NSPS)

A PSE that is only capable of outputting maximum rated power when connected to a qualified load, where the PSE actively qualifies the load. An NSPS has the following characteristics:

  • The PSE maximum rated output power is not available into an open circuit
  • The PSE is limited to ES1, PS1 into an open circuit or a non-qualified load
  • The PSE requires a specific load (e.g. electronically encoded ID), protocol, and/or software to enable the PSE rated output
  • The PSE removes maximum rated power when the qualified load is removed
  • The PSE returns to the non-powered state when in fault
  • Special test equipment will be needed to enable the PSE output.

 

thoughts?

 

 

Chad Jones

Technical Leader, Cisco Systems

Chair, IEEE P802.3da Task Force

Principal, NFPA 70 CMP3

 

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