Hi All,
I would like to share the updated CR document for the TB sensing measurement instance. This document includes the modification of figure 11-41c , 11-41d, and related descriptions reflecting the previous discussions.
to notify the modification, I added the memo at modified points of this document.
Attached, Please find and review it.
And, please let me know if you have any comments and questions for that.
Best regards,
Dongguk.
From: Dongguk Lim [mailto:dongguk.lim@xxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2022 8:35 AM
To: 'dongguk.lim@xxxxxxx' <dongguk.lim@xxxxxxx>; 'STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx' <STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: hg.cho@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
Hi All,
Thanks a lot for your feedbacks and comments.
Regarding the change for figure 11-41c, I did not receive any more comments or opinions from other members.
So, I will update the CR document to apply this change.
If you have any comments about it, I would appreciate it if you could send us a comment.
Best regards,
Dongguk.
From: Dongguk Lim [mailto:dongguk.lim@xxxxxxx]
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2022 5:00 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
Thank you Ali for your explanation.
If we agree to use one simple example (ex., poll +NDPA + TF +report ), by considering this TB sensing measurement instance, I will modify figure 11-41d. and some text that is already described in the current 11bf draft may be also modified by considering the below as explained by Ali..
best regards,
Dongguk.
From: Ali Raissinia [mailto:alirezar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2022 4:02 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
Yes, we don’t need to say scenario but rather choose station with different behavior
For instance there are X STA in a TB Measurement instance
STA-1 no poll + both TX & RX. AP doesn’t include STA in the Polling phase
STA-2 poll + TX only. AP doesn’t include STA in the NDPA sounding nor Reporting phases
STA-3 poll + both TX & RX with no report. AP doesn’t include STA in the Reporting phase
…
From: Sahoo, Anirudha (Fed) <00001823ca88828f-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2022 8:23 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.
After giving it some thoughts, I am fine to have a simple figure as Dongguk suggested. But we should specify all possible combinations of phases (in the text?). I think this is what Ali suggested. Dongguk also suggested to change Fig. 11-41d. If he can point out the what changes he is thinking (to Fig. 11-41d) that would help the discussion.
thanks and regards
-Anirud
Anirudha (Anirud) Sahoo (He/Him)
https://sites.google.com/view/a-sahoo
National Institute of Standards and Technology
Wireless Networks Division
Communications Technology Lab
100 Bureau Drive, Stop 6730
Gaithersburg, MD 20899
Ph: 301-975-4439
From: stds-802-11-tgbf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <stds-802-11-tgbf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of Rajat PUSHKARNA
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2022 6:02 PM
To: Ali Raissinia <alirezar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
Yes, in that case I support Dongguk’s proposal.
Best Regards,
Rajat.
From: Ali Raissinia <alirezar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, 13 September 2022 6:00 pm
To: Rajat PUSHKARNA <rajat.pushkarna@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
Correct, for instance we could indicate the sequence includes 6 responders. Scenario 1, responder x is not assigned to be polled but intends to be TX and RX role and as such only Polling phase is absent, similarly scenario 2, responder is x is only TX and so forth…
Ali
From: Rajat PUSHKARNA <rajat.pushkarna@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2022 11:32 AM
To: Ali Raissinia <alirezar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.
Ali,
To understand you better, you mean to keep Dongguk’s figure and add sensing responder’s roles to explain which phase it would support?
For example, if a sensing responder is a sensing receiver it can only support NDPA sounding phase and for a sensing responder which is a sensing transmitter it would support TF sounding phase?
Best Regards,
Rajat.
From: Ali Raissinia <alirezar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, 13 September 2022 5:27 pm
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
I tend to support Dongguk’s new approach by replacing the exiting diagrams and come up with one with list scenarios (for different devices) to highlight which phase(s) would be absent. It is much simpler and less confusing as to the TB sequence and the order in which they would appear (if present).
This would be convey the same thing that is currently showing in the current diagrams.
Regards,
Ali
From: Sahoo, Anirudha (Fed) <00001823ca88828f-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2022 11:10 AM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.
Hi Dongguk,
I like Figure 11-41c as it is depicted currently in D0.2. It shows different combinations of TB MI, (it is ok if it may not be exhaustive). Replacing it with just a simple one that you suggested will make it difficult for someone, who reads the spec for the first time, to visualize different signaling combinations. Looking at this figure one immediately gets the idea that a TB MI can have many different types of signaling. So, I suggest that we keep those combinations currently in the draft and work to remove ambiguity. Some combination may not be correct. For example, if/when we decide the order of TF and NDPA sounding, either example 3 or 4 would become wrong. Also, I am confused about example 5, but we can correct/clarify example 5. In summary, I would urge not to get rid of those different cases of TB MI, but rather work on making it clear or unambiguous.
thanks and regards
-Anirud
Anirudha (Anirud) Sahoo (He/Him)
https://sites.google.com/view/a-sahoo
National Institute of Standards and Technology
Wireless Networks Division
Communications Technology Lab
100 Bureau Drive, Stop 6730
Gaithersburg, MD 20899
Ph: 301-975-4439
From: stds-802-11-tgbf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <stds-802-11-tgbf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of Dongguk Lim
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2022 4:26 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: hg.cho@xxxxxxx
Subject: Discussion for the example of TB sensing measrurement instance
Hi All,
I hope you are being well.
When I presented the DCN 22/1330r0 in the previous 11bf CC, we have a lot of discussion regarding the examples of TB sensing measurement instances described in figure 11-41c.
To illustrate the various examples for the TB sensing measurement instance, we considered showing some considered examples of the TB sensing measurement instance.
However, as you felt in during the previous CC, due to various examples described in figure 11-41c, it occurred a misunderstanding and ambiguity in the configuration of the TB sensing measurement instance.
Since it is just an example to explain the TB sensing measurement, I think that we can simply the figure 11-41c with a figure which includes only one example as below to avoid misunderstanding and ambiguities.
Figure 11-41c Example of a TB sensing measruement instance
Also, regarding this figure, we can consider the modification of figure 11-41d, for the explanation of the operation for the STAs participating in this TB sensing measurement instance.
After the discussion for the change, if we determine to change figure 11-41 with the suggested one, I will also provide the modification of figure 11-41d regarding the description together.
In addition, even though the figure(11-41c) is modified as including only one example, we can have more time to discuss the issues related to the TB sensing measurement instance, for example, the order of each phase, configuration, etc.
I would like to hear your opinions on the suggested change regarding figures 11-41.
Please feel free to give your opinions..
Best regards,
Dongguk.
________________________________________________________________________________________
Dongguk Lim
Chief Technology Officer IoT Connectivity Standard Task/Professional
LG Electronics Inc
19, Yangjae-daero 11-gil, Seocho-gu, Seoul, Korea
M.82-10-8996-4690 E.dongguk.lim@xxxxxxx
___________________________________________________________________
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