Dear Harmen,
     
        My question to service providers are 
    really that, to the
    service providers -- these may include some of the other target 
    
    markets you mentioned.  802.4 was a great technology that 
    
    no one used. 802.5, while IEEE stds, never 
    achieved broad
    interoperability in the industry and did get displaced w/ 
    10BASE-T.  
    FDDI was a great backbone technology that actually got used, until 
    Fast Ethernet switches displaced it.  All of these technology wanted 
    
    to be the dominant technology that Ethernet is today 
    once it grew up, 
    but it did not.
     
        I could say the same thing about RPR.  It 
    could take over the
    future networking as the preferred standard 
    everywhere; then again, 
    it may not.  RPR is great 
    technology for packet-on-ring, coat-tailing
    off of successes of SONET for TDM.  So if SONET service ring 
    is
    preferred method for Metro distribution, RPR ring may do the same 
    for
    the packet delivery in Metro, and its extensions as the backbone to 
    
    the Ethernet-First-Mile technology.  All other applications, 
    while
    appropriate and possible, is hard to justify with real numbers.  
    Also,
    I do not want to solve the problem that has been solved (and one 
    of
    the 5 criteria, uniqueness, addresses this as well).  We ought 
    to 
    optimize RPR for the clear application(s) 
    we used to justify it.  
     
        At this point, I have NO vested interest in 
    influencing the
    standard to fit any implementation.  I hope you and readers take 
    my
    opinion as it reads -- do not optimize the standard for <~5% of 
    the 
    market, if it is at the risk of higher 
    cost(complexity, interoperability,
    etc, etc) or scalability.
     
        regards,
     
    Yong.
    ============================================
Yongbum "Yong" 
    Kim      Direct (408)922-7502
Technical 
    Director      Mobile (408)887-1058
3151 Zanker 
    Road        Fax    
    (408)922-7530
San Jose, CA 95134      
    Main   
    (408)501-7800
ybkim@xxxxxxxxxxxx      
    www.broadcom.com
============================================
  
    
    
    Dear Yong
     
    If you only ask service providers whether they 
    would like to support lower speed rings, you not really ask the market that 
    I addressed in my mail. That market has very much to do with communications, 
    but it is not the target of service prioviders. It is the broad market 
    of future multimedia communications mainly in facilities outside the 
    area of network operators and service providers. It is complementory to 
    802.3 networks, it is the world that previously was addressed by 802.4, 
    802.5, and FDDI. I do not really understand why that market would not be of 
    interest to IEEE 802.17. Why should those areas live outside the standard, 
    when they perfectly fit to resilience and QoS. New standard 
    neccessary?
     
    Additionally addressed market:
    rings and backbone rings for small offices, 
    hotels, major stores, small business centers, hospitals, companies, campus 
    areas, manufactury plants, industrial plants, small public access areas, 
    ships, airplaines, cars, interconnection of base stations of wireless 
    networks, etc., etc.
     
    Best regards
    Harmen
     
     
    Yongbum Kim wrote:
     
    
     
    
 Dear Harmen,
  
    
     Related to the on-going preemption discussions 
    and how
 high priority, low-latency & jitter is handled, I agree 
    
 that high speed RPR ring does not need preemption, but 
    the
 lower speed one does.
  
     I 
    would like to go back to "broad market potential" 
 requirements, 
    and would like to hear from the Service Provider
 community on this 
    subject.  
      How many of the rings in 
    the metro that already has OC3 
      ~ OC12 
    rings in a SONET infrastructure will be retrofitted 
    
      w/ RPR for packet services?  
    
  
     My assumption in this had been that 
    if a vendor installs new 
 equipment, it would be the latest and 
    fastest available box, because
 installation and upgrade cost 
    out-weigh box cost.  So the percentage
 of the retrofit market 
    is relatively minimal.  If this is the case, 
 lower speed MAC 
    behavior could live outside of the standard.  If this
 is not 
    the case, then we must define a single preemption behavior
 for all 
    speeds of operation (again the second if, if the group
 wants to 
    entertain the objective of supporting this high priority
 low 
    latency & jitter class). 
  
     Would 
    someone from the Service Provider community provide some 
 feedback 
    on this retrofit market?
  
 regards,
  
    
 Yong.
  
     
     ============================================
 Yongbum 
    "Yong" Kim      Direct 
    (408)922-7502
 Technical Director      
    Mobile (408)887-1058
 3151 Zanker 
    Road        Fax    
    (408)922-7530
 San Jose, CA 95134      
    Main   (408)501-7800
 ybkim@xxxxxxxxxxxx      www.broadcom.com ============================================