RE: [802.21] [DNA] Prefix information for link identification in DNA
>Think MIP. It gets a trigger from MIH to switch over into an
>alternate ethnology which then assigns the IP through MIP
>interaction. By saying MIH is available after IP is assigned
>you killed MIP as a user.
We should be careful not to mix link and MIH triggers on the local stack
with remote triggers between two nodes. The transport under discussion
is for "remote CS/ES".
>Think MIP again. It detects movement when FA advertises. It
>can take minutes no msecs.
This is exactly why I said you must have a specific handover procedure
in mind. The handover procedure itself is slow and not suitable for RT
services irrespective of how the MIH services are provided (that's why
they have fast handover). One of the main latency issue in IPv4 (basic
MIP) is due to IP address configuration. It is a little better in IPv6,
you can send a Router Solicitation and do stateless address auto
configuration.
I would sincerely like to know how MIH services at L2 can solve this
problem. 802.21 MIH aids in handover, but we should rememeber that the
overall handover performance depends on the L3 handover procedure
itself.
>-----Original Message-----
>From: ext Peretz Feder [mailto:pfeder@lucent.com]
>Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 11:04 AM
>To: Sreemanthula Srinivas (Nokia-NRC/Dallas)
>Cc: STDS-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
>Subject: Re: [802.21] [DNA] Prefix information for link
>identification in DNA
>
>
>
>On 9/30/2005 11:49 AM, Srinivas.Sreemanthula@nokia.com wrote:
>
>>OK, good we cleared that.
>>
>>We are doing inter-tech (or iinter-subnet) handovers of IP
>services, so
>>the UE already has the IP connectivity both to current and
>target (via
>>current).
>>
>Think MIP. It gets a trigger from MIH to switch over into an
>alternate ethnology which then assigns the IP through MIP
>interaction. By saying MIH is available after IP is assigned
>you killed MIP as a user.
>Eliminating MIP as an MIH user is a fatal mistake for 802.21,
>as MIP is the numero uno MM user IMO.
>
>>
>>On the issue of performance, It all depends on the specific handover
>>scenario and procedure you are referring to. Another related
>issue is
>>the relative performance gains between implementing L2 MIH vs L3 MIH.
>>If the IP services handover delay constraints can be met with
>L3 MIH, I
>>don't need the additional 10ms improvement with the L2 MIH.
>>
>Think MIP again. It detects movement when FA advertises. It
>can take minutes no msecs.
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>________________________________
>>
>> From: ext Peretz Feder [mailto:pfeder@LUCENT.COM]
>> Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 10:07 AM
>> To: STDS-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
>> Subject: Re: [802.21] [DNA] Prefix information for link
>identification
>>in DNA
>>
>>
>> "I do not understand how any one would conclude that
>the MIH services
>>are only between UE and the AP/BS."
>>
>> The discussion is PoA and not services. The 1st PoA
>could be L2 for IS
>>and CS. With no PoA at L2, the poor UE will have no MIH
>services until
>>IP is established. The performance will be very different, not to
>>mention a UE with a bridging only attributes, such as 802.16 terminal
>>with only Ethernet CS (no IP CS).
>>
>> Nobody is saying MIH services are strictly between UE and BS.
>>Performance will be better when PoA L2 MIH is established.
>>
>> Peretz
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/30/2005 10:50 AM, Srinivas.Sreemanthula@nokia.com wrote:
>>
>>
>> The MIIS is provisioned between MIH in UE to a
>network counter part
>>any
>> where in the network. This network node can
>either act as a proxy
>>info
>> server or an info server. We also identified
>MIIS requires L3 and
>>hence
>> the WG went through the exercise of identifying
>all the UL
>>requirements
>> and establish coordination with IETF. However,
>in that discussion,
>>there
>> was no reference to whether the AP/BS was MIH
>or non-MIH capable.
>>
>> Even if we leave out the info services from the
>discussion, I do not
>> understand how any one would conclude that the
>MIH services are only
>> between UE and the AP/BS.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: ext Peretz Feder
>>[mailto:pfeder@lucent.com]
>> Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 9:39 AM
>> To: Sreemanthula Srinivas (Nokia-NRC/Dallas)
>> Cc: STDS-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
>> Subject: Re: [802.21] [DNA] Prefix
>information for link
>> identification in DNA
>>
>> Are you indicating attaching to a non
>MIH enabled AP/BS and
>> receiving MIH IS over R4 from a remote
>MIH info server?
>>
>>
>> On 9/30/2005 10:27 AM,
>>Srinivas.Sreemanthula@nokia.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Did we miss the whole
>discussion of MIH information services?
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: ext Peretz Feder
>>[mailto:pfeder@LUCENT.COM]
>> Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005
>>9:16 AM
>> To:
>>STDS-802-21@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
>> Subject: Re: [802.21] [DNA]
>>Prefix information for link
>>
>>
>> identification
>>
>>
>> in DNA
>>
>>
>> "you have first to be very clear
>>about what you're attaching"
>>
>> I would think that in 802.21, we
>>first attach the UE's
>>
>>
>> MIH to a BS/AP
>>
>>
>> that supports MIH capability.
>>
>> On 9/30/2005 8:55 AM, Stefano M.
>>Faccin wrote:
>>
>>
>> Mike, well said!
>> Stefano
>>
>>
>>________________________________
>>
>> From: ext Mike Moreton
>>[mailto:mm2006@MAILSNARE.NET]
>> Sent: Fri 9/30/2005 3:09
>>AM
>> To:
>>STDS-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
>> Subject: Re: [802.21]
>>[DNA] Prefix information for link
>> identification in DNA
>>
>>
>>
>> To extend (I think!)
>>Stefano's point, before
>>
>>
>> determining what the PoA
>>
>>
>> is, you have first to be very
>clear about what you're
>>
>>
>> attaching. Just
>>
>>
>> saying "the terminal" makes no sense,
>>because different layers in the
>> terminal's protocol stack attach to
>>different places in the network.
>>
>> For example, the PHY
>>layer attaches to the AP,
>>
>>
>> but the TCP layer
>>
>>
>> attaches to the destination host.
>>
>> Mike.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original
>>Message-----
>> From: Stefano M.
>>Faccin
>> [mailto:stefano.faccin@NOKIA.COM]
>> Sent: Friday,
>>September 30, 2005 1:08 AM
>> To:
>>STDS-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
>> Subject: Re:
>>[802.21] [DNA] Prefix
>>
>>
>> information for link
>>
>>
>> identification
>>in DNA
>>
>>
>> Yoshihiro,
>> I'm not sure why
>>should restrict the
>>
>>
>> term PoA to have only a
>>
>>
>> L2 meaning as
>>you suggest below. I
>>
>>
>> think we should
>>
>>
>> distinguish
>>clearly between L2 PoA and L3 PoA.
>> For me, the L3
>> PoA is where the
>>terminal gets IP conenctivity.
>> E.g. for GPRS
>> the L3 PoA is
>>the IP link on which the
>>
>>
>> GGSN is located. In
>>
>>
>> L2, PoA is the
>>point where the access-specific
>> L2 connection
>> terminates (e.g.
>>an AP in 802.11).
>> Stefano
>>
>>
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