Re: [802.3_100GNGOPTX] Minutes Uploaded - Forward Direction
Hi Chris,
I think that a lot of folks on the list are having trouble distinguishing the difference in the meaning of "price" and "cost", but also about the meaning of the word "relative".
If people start describing costs relative to something they can buy today, and everybody knows the price of what they can buy today, people assume that if the same margins were to apply, they can infer a relative price. This gets dangerous in that you are essentially deciding "how big is a banana", and then using bananas as currency.
The idea of "relative" to my understanding is that you need to restrict yourself to "A" vs. "B" comparisons, and not put the universe on a common scale which amounts to defining a currency which basically translates to price. So if you have two ways to solve a problem, you can compare the relative costs of those two solutions. If you are trying to test if a "replacement" PMD is justified, you would want to analyze the long term cost of what is inside of the module to see if that looks to cost enough less, long term, to be worth building.
What I see people trying to do is to establish this currency where folks are asked to compare their own proposal to some baseline (e.g., SR10) assuming that if everyone uses the same baseline, you can do arithmetic and effectively compare the relative costs of solution A vs solution B, not by actually comparing them directly against each other, but by using some other established currency. I am not sure this is a really productive exercise either, since I think it would just create a game of "liar's poker" with every contributor trying to construct a story that puts their solution at the lowest "cost" based on this common currency. This assumption is wrong unless you can guarantee that everyone who does this is equally thorough, equally honest, equally optimistic (or pessimistic). The common scale won't help you: you really need to look at solutions directly against each other.
Regards,
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Cole [mailto:chris.cole@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2012 2:35 PM
To: STDS-802-3-100GNGOPTX@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [802.3_100GNGOPTX] Minutes Uploaded - Forward Direction
John
Can you explain the difference between the discussion of relative module
costs in NG 100G OE SG, and the discussion of relative module costs in
HSSG and 802.3ba including of specific form factors?
Chris
-----Original Message-----
From: John D'Ambrosia [mailto:jdambrosia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2012 1:14 PM
To: STDS-802-3-100GNGOPTX@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [802.3_100GNGOPTX] Minutes Uploaded - Forward Direction
Dan,
Let me clear - do not include me on any discussions regarding price.
That is an inappropriate discussion and I do not want to be involved!
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Daniel Dove [mailto:ddove@xxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2012 4:11 PM
To: STDS-802-3-100GNGOPTX@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [802.3_100GNGOPTX] Minutes Uploaded - Forward Direction
Seriously, folks;
I am going to officially ask that if you wish to talk about products and
their relative prices, please do it on a different discussion forum.
Maybe an email thread among friends?
We are here to talk about IEEE standards, PMDs, and their relative
costs.
Dan Dove
Chair, Next Generation 100G Ethernet Study Group